no rank kills myth

[par73]

bring back the ranking system or implement something because the server is ass without it.

[BIG KROK V8 SS]

I've said for years that if rank goes away, so does Myth. Now look at us.

[HeadHunterKC]

what paris and kirk said...

[punkUser]

While I sympathize and it's still on the TODO list, the claim is vacuously untrue. Rank/stats was broken on Mnet for years before the crash and no one really cared, because frankly it was pretty useless before too.

I get that you like pretty icons and such, but you do realize that it will be utterly meaningless right now, correct? I mean, I might as well just give you an icon based on something like how many games you play or your damage ratio. Would that make people happy, because it's no less accurate than some sort of Elo system with current player counts.

I think stuff like people not being able to host is slightly higher priority right now, but if people have good programming skillz and want to help, I'm always open to it.

[drunken_deer]

easily one of the dumbest responses punkuser, I would of just made it a high priority and tried to go with suggestions to de-fibrillate myth from reaching critical life signs regardless of how stupid it may seem.

[BIG KROK V8 SS]

GET UR SHIT TOGETHER. I'LL HELP YOU IF I GET SISTER'S DIGITS ##########

[punkUser]

easily one of the dumbest responses punkuser

Yawn, keep displaying your ignorance. I'd let you put your money where your mouth is but unfortunately I doubt you have the skill or experience to help with anything useful here... (see I can be bitchy too guys! )

At this point any claim about why few people play Myth beyond "because it's a really old game with no easy way to buy it" is lunacy. I get that psychologically it's tempting to just pick some personal bitch-point and attribute your perception of the current situation entirely to it (since the world conforms to your persona), but use your heads. The game has been following a steady, predictable decline for years despite various factors. Accept that there is literally nothing you can do if the core issues - chiefly lack of 21st century game distribution (Steam, GoG, otherwise) - are not addressed.

I'm willing to admit that the hosting situation in a world of ubiquitous NAT, ISP-provided routers and relatively low user tech-saavyness is a legitimate issue that has only been growing in importance over the past decade and something that absolutely would have to be addressed even if the distribution problem was solved. As I said, I'm working on a solution to that so that at least the few new players who have popped on over the past few months won't continue to just disappear due to not being able to host/play.

But yeah, arguments of the form "X kills Myth because Myth is continuing to slowly decline and X is not present" are dumb person logic. I've heard it for all X. In reality there is no mystery as to why Myth is in the situation that it is now, so trotting out this silly argument doesn't add any weight to your requests.

tl/dr Yes some sort of ranking is still on the TODO list. No it is not high priority given the amount of work relative to the current size of the community.

[Pogue]

easily one of the dumbest responses punkuser, I would of just made it a high priority and tried to go with suggestions to de-fibrillate myth from reaching critical life signs regardless of how stupid it may seem.

[youtube]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ToQVoyWWluQ[/youtube]

[BIG KROK V8 SS]

LOL MORE BRADY PLAYOFF CHOKE DAY. HOW MANY FLUTTERBALLS DID BRADY THROW TODAY? ENOUGH TO SUCK DICK. LOL

[par73]

While I sympathize and it's still on the TODO list, the claim is vacuously untrue. Rank/stats was broken on Mnet for years before the crash and no one really cared, because frankly it was pretty useless before too.

Hmm becaue you were on ranked on mariusnet for years and witnessed people caring or not caring. rgr


people put meaning into whatever they want to put meaning into
who cares if the system isn't perfect?
we played myth world cups with less than 50 teams before right? right.

i just don't see how this is still on the bottom of the to do-list
i also don't understand how people not being able to host has more to do with the GoS server or administrators than the actual people attempting to host.
i consider you more likely to be able to set up a ranked system (whether it's efficient or not, who cares, at least you have one; people can find a problem with anythin.), than You being able to access other players computers / brains and figure out their hosting issues, but I guess that is not where we see eye to eye?


ranked myth gives players something to do besides the same old shit that is needed to simply keep the game running.
I'm just saying, if this was re-prioritized to be higher on the list I'm sure it would be appreciated.

myth's been on a 'steady-decline', hmm but seems about as active as it was in 2005 when playmyth was having bundles of server problems or 2007/2008 during the same shit.


i'm wondering if you actually ever fixed any of the server issues people were having with actually connecting to GOS (when the server has more than 40 people it shit the bed), because during the summer when people 'had usable hosts' they couldn't connect to the server to see an available host anyway


saying a ranking system for multiplayer myth is pretty useless, seems to be similar logic that goes hand in hand with even bothering to play myth is useless because it's too old.

apparently bungie.net ranked myth's meaningfulness has indeed quelled the idea that rank on a modern myth server would ever be meaningful to anyone.



it is true that "lack of X is killing Y, because Y no longer has X and Y is now valued less than with X" logic can be simple man or stupid man logic, but who cares, a community this size will never grow without competition and a place to begin competitive nature

[HeadHunterKC]

actually a ton of people cared.

Specifically all of those who didn't play.

And to be fair, in the early days of m.net, the majority of us cared about a ranking system. There were only a couple of people who implemented it and by that time we were so beaten down after having to resort to battlenet.com or whatever that we appreciated having a server in the first place.

Rank matters.

This shouldn't be a debate.

[HeadHunterKC]

I'm not saying its easy or that it will be a smooth implementation, especially since I know noting about it, what I am saying, is anything that adds value to the idea of logging on in the first place should be a high priority.

[punkUser]

I'm not even going to bother par - basically everything in your post is factually incorrect. Suffice it to say for anyone else reading his post, don't believe any of it. I don't expect you to understand tech par, but at least defer to someone who does about technical matters.

I'm not saying its easy or that it will be a smooth implementation, especially since I know noting about it, what I am saying, is anything that adds value to the idea of logging on in the first place should be a high priority.

Obviously, but it's always a cost/benefit tradeoff. In this case there is simply more "value" that can be added with my limited time in other areas than spending a ton of time on ranking. If it was a few hours of work for a large benefit absolutely it would be top of the list, unfortunately it is very much skewed the other direction. Allowing everyone to host is simply a much more tractable (time-wise), and much more important problem to handle first.

To be clear, I absolutely don't mind people voting on feature priorities (hence the thread in the metaserver forums - please contribute!). But cut the BS and grandiose claims and be happy you have a server at all (or feel free to start your own). Also if you really want a feature, you may want to ban paris from saying anything about it

[par73]

I'm not even going to bother par - basically everything in your post is factually incorrect. Suffice it to say for anyone else reading his post, don't believe any of it. I don't expect you to understand tech par, but at least defer to someone who does about technical matters.

I'm not saying its easy or that it will be a smooth implementation, especially since I know noting about it, what I am saying, is anything that adds value to the idea of logging on in the first place should be a high priority.

Obviously, but it's always a cost/benefit tradeoff. In this case there is simply more "value" that can be added with my limited time in other areas than spending a ton of time on ranking. If it was a few hours of work for a large benefit absolutely it would be top of the list, unfortunately it is very much skewed the other direction. Allowing everyone to host is simply a much more tractable (time-wise), and much more important problem to handle first.

To be clear, I absolutely don't mind people voting on feature priorities (hence the thread in the metaserver forums - please contribute!). But cut the BS and grandiose claims and be happy you have a server at all (or feel free to start your own). Also if you really want a feature, you may want to ban paris from saying anything about it

Don't get pissed off because I simply stated I think ranked play would help facilitate players and games played on gate of storms

The ranking on marius.net wasn't broken for years, not really sure why you're trying to argue that.

I didn't start this topic to "VOTE ON FEATURE PRIORITIES" or whatever crap you have in store to waste everyone's time with. What's the point of voting if there's only one person in charge of pulling the trigger anyway, and that punk user does not want to be bothered. (tehe) I started this topic to start raising the priority of having ranked play on a server; now I'm also wondering what kind of "Changes" have been implemented and made based on priority since August 2013, seeing as how there has been so much time to get so much gateofstorms "problems" fixed.
Seems like there has been none, and it's not like anyone would know anyway because the News page never gets updated (because there isn't one) and the last Announcement made for the server was October 2013.

I don't know how you can even measure cost/benefits of the priorities seeing as how your observations would ultimately be skewed in some sort of error. Seems more like you are just measuring assumptions of potentials.

"be happy you have a server at all, or feel free to start your own" - MNA OM 2014

Please lets stop talking about how beneficial or not implementing a ranking system would be for retaining players who log on to play the actual game.
So let me ponder again, what exactly are you working on that is going to benefit this server so much at the moment?

[punkUser]

I simply stated I think ranked play would help facilitate players and games played on myth

Oh that's all you said? Ok you might want to go back and edit most of your posts in this thread then cause I think people might misread your statements a bit beyond that pleasant reply

[Honkey]

I quit playing myth because the last tournament I played in was horrible. I just wanted to sign in and play a couple of OK games, and I couldn't even play because I didn't want to deal with a drunken deer/ Bagrada temper tantrum if I sat one more than the other. That tournament was the biggest waste of time ever... and I vowed not to join another tournament or waste my weekend free time to deal with that kind of horse shit again.

The moral of the story is: People acting like blatant assholes and raging like bitches are the reasons the game is dead. Not ranked icons. and also the fact it was made in 98 and its 2014 probably has something to do with it, although if you look at a game like EVE they still have 40K players on at a time.

[punkUser]

although if you look at a game like EVE they still have 40K players on at a time.

Kind of a different story though as it receives active updates/development. What PM does on volunteer time to keep the game running on modern systems is not really the same thing.

That makes me curious though... does anyone know AAA games for PC/Mac of the relative age of Myth 2 that still get thousands of concurrent users? Starcraft 1 probably... anything else?

[punkUser]

now I'm also wondering what kind of "Changes" have been implemented and made based on priority since August 2013

Read the metaserver forum - all of the changelogs are posted there. You'd be pretty incorrect in assuming there haven't been any changes, particularly considering there have been some fairly obvious features added. I'll let you figure out how to find that though as it will server you well in the future

I don't know how you can even measure cost/benefits of the priorities seeing as how your observations would ultimately be skewed in some sort of error. Seems more like you are just measuring assumptions of potentials.

Paris stop trying to use big words. You invariably make no sense and embarrass yourself.

But I'm really done bickering with you man. You have nothing of value to offer, spout blatant lies and misinformation all of the place and don't even make an attempt at being reasonable. I've got better things to do with my time than counsel your bipolar outbursts. Seriously paris, I don't owe you a single thing so stop acting so entitled.

[BIG KROK V8 SS]

BOOTY BOOTY BOOTY BOOTY KROKKIN EVERYWHERE

[par73]

I was never acting entitled to a single thing from you, I was just saying, having ranked on myth is a plus not a minus.

Also I was simply the fact that you're not perfect and neither am I so why play it off like this is some sort of 'low' priority when it is a classic part of myth. It has been unranked since the start thus there is no surprise the only players to hold the winter are the Mazzarin Dungeon Crawlers. I really don't remember you on ranked myth, were you ever there? really? I think HH was there, I don't know if you would remember that though, so maybe you wouldn't understand what he's saying about a ranking system having value on myth.

HH brings up a comment that the feature is positive in nature and *anything* could only help at this point. of course, what he said is invalid because it in part backs up what i was stating in jab with the title of this thread 'no rank kills myth'. i'm not here to say not having rank kills myth, i'm just saying it never hurt. plenty of other shit, yes honkey like the fact the game is 15+ years old, obviously has helped 'kill' myth.

2013 didn't have any ranked myth, why not bring it back for 2014?

[punkUser]

See, that's a totally fine post, thanks! Just lead with that next time and we'll all be happier

[toynbee]

it's kinda obvious that this moron PunkUser is arguing against ranked because he has no idea how to implement it

[jason_ac]

I don't know how you can even measure cost/benefits of the priorities seeing as how your observations would ultimately be skewed in some sort of error.

Because he knows how much work it will be, and he can do whatever the hell he feels like with his spare time. Including ignoring everyone that likes having the GoS server be operational. Be grateful he doesn't. Or keep being a rude ass and be just one more reason why he should forget about keeping the server running. For free.

You should be kissing the ground punkuser walks on. Or you can go play on Marius Net. Oh wait, that's right, it's down. You're lucky he likes Myth so much that he lets rude, ungrateful asses play on his server. Because if punkuser were slightly less devoted to Myth, he'd ban you from his server for being an ass.

[jason_ac]

I was never acting entitled to a single thing from you

That's exactly how you're coming across.

[jason_ac]

it's kinda obvious that this moron PunkUser is arguing against ranked because he has no idea how to implement it

And how many Myth servers have you built? In your spare time? And kept running? For free? With users like you, why should punkuser even bother to keep the server running at all?

Ditto what I told par...you should be kissing the ground punkuser walks on. You're lucky he likes Myth so much that he lets rude, ungrateful asses play on his server. Because if punkuser were slightly less devoted to Myth, he'd ban you from his server for being an ass.

[Pogue]

STFU KIRK, STEELERS DIDN'T EVEN MAKE THE PLAYOFFS. BIG FAT BEN STUFFED HIS ASS WITH CLARK BARS ALL SEASON, AND ASMO'S HIPPY idiot TEAM LOST. STOP ACTING SO HAPPY MORAN.

[par73]

Jason, despite I am grateful for PunkUser's attempt at preservation of the Myth 2 Series; I am more grateful of what he's actually doing at the root of hosting a myth server, rather than the actual product. Generous time spent for all indeed, however statements like "Then build your own server" i.e. undermine the actual generosity. I still believe there are better embalming tools he could use at his disposal, although "PunkUser may have to travel through time in order to uncover these tools". Honestly the monotonous "you should be eternally grateful and give worship", I say whatever kill it off then if you wanna be like that. Sounds like some false idol shit.

I could be writing a post, instead, about how PunkUser has done great things with the server and players of myth such as jason are eternally grateful for his efforts. however that would be too moot and obvious, anyone can do that. if I wasn't grateful for PunkUser's efforts, why would I be here making suggestions and being skeptical.
I'm still saying, no rank kills myth.
I think it would be beneficial if more time was spent on creating/recreating a rank system, despite the fact admin himself may not ever use the feature himself.
There isn't just one lens or one angle to view the world. And to say that shouldn't be respected is a crock of shit.

I understand PunkUser isn't superman, but sometimes I wish that he is.

[jason_ac]

I am grateful for PunkUser's attempt at preservation of the Myth 2 Series

Being rude, demanding, insulting, and disrespectful towards someone that has given you something for free, in his spare time, is a poor way to show gratitude.

>statements like "Then build your own server" i.e. undermine the actual generosity.

NOTHING could undermine the hours he spends in his spare time to give us this server. "Then build your own server" is a NICE response towards someone who is being rude, demanding, insulting, and disrespectful.

You don't have to worship him. But you should not be rude, demanding, insulting, & disrespectful to anyone that has not given you cause to be so. And especially not to someone who gives you something valuable for free.

>if I wasn't grateful for PunkUser's efforts

Being rude, demanding, insulting, and disrespectful doesn't show any gratitude.

>I'm still saying, no rank kills myth.

Ok. That's a perfectly reasonable judgment to have.

>despite the fact admin himself may not ever use the feature himself.

punkuser's reasons for not making a ranking system have nothing to do with whether he personally cares about rank or not. You need to go re-read what he's written about that, in this thread, and elsewhere on the forums.

>There isn't just one lens or one angle to view the world.

No one has said there is. And I've seen respectful debate on the forum about the merits and difficulty of ranking systems. People are accepting differing viewpoints, when they're expressed respectfully.

>And to say that shouldn't be respected is a crock of shit.

No one's said that. And holy crap, so you're rude, demanding, insulting, and disrespectful towards someone that spends countless hours building and maintaining a free server you like, but you're upset when you mistakenly believe that your opinion (which took you a few MINUTES to make up out of thin air and type) isn't being respected?!? It's not "your opinion" that isn't being given respect...it's your horrible *presentation* of your opinion that is not deserving of respect. You need to learn some perspective. The world doesn't revolve around you.

[vinylrake]

Toynbee, the only thing that is obvious here (other than that some people feel entitled to whatever they want just because they want it (aka "I think it would be a good idea") is that you don't have the tiniest clue what you are talking about.

But please feel free to go on pretending you know how to code a game server and pretend you have an accurate grasp of how difficult (or easy) it would be to implement a ranking system.

And obviously you are such a genius - everyone should know that insulting someone who is giving you something for free is a great way to get what you want.

[punkUser]

Alright, I think we're basically down to trolling at this point which isn't serving anyone any good. Thanks for the input everyone, feel free to post other stuff in the Metaserver forum if you have something to add. Please keep it civil though, as I have only so much patience for the other bits. And as several of us have now pointed out, you might find you have more influence if you learn how to communicate like an adult