Asmo's ratings - MWC edition

Homer · Post by **Homer** » 30 Jul 2013, 19:47

1 v 1 soul fight GC? lets go. LETS GO. LETS FUCKING GO idiot. IM ON MYTH RIGHT NOW. YOU WON"T YOU WON"T YOU SCARED?

Kryptos · Post by **Kryptos** » 30 Jul 2013, 19:48

adrenaline wrote:Let's be real, Kryptos. Me vs. you on a flank... all things equal... I am winning that fight 9/10 times, no matter what the units are. You are a good player, but don't put yourself on a level with either me, or GK... we are both in a league above you.

Just no.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 30 Jul 2013, 19:51

Well... feel free to disagree, but that is just the truth of the matter. I've played with and against you enough to know that you really can't hang with the upper echelon.

Cutard · Post by **Cutard** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:01

Do people honestly think of 2 team games like its a bunch of 1v1s or 2v2s across the map? The only time I was ever concerned about who was facing who was trowing and maybe in very rare instances fetching.

godcops · Post by **godcops** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:06

Adrenaline does because he's a tard.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:12

it obviously varies map to map, but yes, 1v1 and 2v2 matchups DO happen in 2-team games quite often... artillery flanks, rush pack vs rush pack, etc. Just off the top of my head...

The Barrens (venice x2)... flanks are often a 1v1 of a few warrs, a lock, a puss ghol or something like that.
Desert... flanks are often a 2v2 of warrs/bows/dorf/puss. Yes, often the flanks get reinforced, but not always.
Trow often has 1v1 flanks.
Been in many 1v1 situations on Poison Holiday light or dark on a flank.
Caer light... seen many 1v1 flanks.
Creep and Hver are often 2v2 flanks of roughly equal units.

Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.

There is a reason that most (if not all) of the top 1v1ers are also considered top team players.

tirri · Post by **tirri** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:18

Im not too worried about tmnt. Seems to me that with our captain and 2 best players the match would have been an easy sweep.

Also am I missing something or was tmnts best player by far (Sam) an illegal sub going by the ratings? Meanwhile adren to ghengis was legal. Seems pretty lame but thats what tmnt is all about.

Cutard · Post by **Cutard** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:24

adrenaline wrote:it obviously varies map to map, but yes, 1v1 and 2v2 matchups DO happen in 2-team games quite often... artillery flanks, rush pack vs rush pack, etc. Just off the top of my head...

The Barrens (venice x2)... flanks are often a 1v1 of a few warrs, a lock, a puss ghol or something like that.
Desert... flanks are often a 2v2 of warrs/bows/dorf/puss. Yes, often the flanks get reinforced, but not always.
Trow often has 1v1 flanks.
Been in many 1v1 situations on Poison Holiday light or dark on a flank.
Caer light... seen many 1v1 flanks.
Creep and Hver are often 2v2 flanks of roughly equal units.

Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.

There is a reason that most (if not all) of the top 1v1ers are also considered top team players.

Well this explains so much.

East Wind tmnt · Post by **East Wind tmnt** » 30 Jul 2013, 20:54

tirri wrote:Im not too worried about tmnt. Seems to me that with our captain and 2 best players the match would have been an easy sweep.

Also am I missing something or was tmnts best player by far (Sam) an illegal sub going by the ratings? Meanwhile adren to ghengis was legal. Seems pretty lame but thats what tmnt is all about.

chill out henry tirri

noblesteed · Post by **noblesteed** » 30 Jul 2013, 21:33

adrenaline wrote:yes, you go ahead and keep buying into that "1v1 doesn't translate into 2-team" school of thought.

also consider i've been the kills/dmg leader and heavyhitter on a top contender/championship team for years, not to mention the ratios leader for a few MWCs... you seem to have overlooked that fact.

either way, TMNS will be playing ZOMG in the BB finals on Aug. 11... stay tuned.

uh aren't we playing this weekend in the semi finals?

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 30 Jul 2013, 21:41

No, TMNS plays DEER next. And, yet again, I won't be here this weekend. Which is a shame, because I'd love to show Sasper how real men play myth.

wwo · Post by **wwo** » 30 Jul 2013, 21:47

adrenaline wrote:Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.

I'm not disagreeing.

You might not remember fully, but I hosted a desert fr game with pretty much all good players right before Agents' 4pm DE2 match. You and chron were N against me and Asmo, and I think the only unit difference was y'all were +1 pus. South was the real action, with me and chron mirroring each other to either give an advantage mid or stop a disadvantage N. Either way, at least twice you and Asmo were faced off with neglible unit difference. At no time did you try to push, and it would've been stupid for him to do so considering your terrain defensive advantage. At the end of the game (we won), you said it was boring. Couldn't you have tried to do something to (a) make it less boring or (b) treat it like a 1v1 and probably given your team an increasingly needed boost? Or was Asmo that intimidating?

toxyn · Post by **toxyn** » 30 Jul 2013, 22:48

Asmodian wrote: Two

Toxyn

Works for me. Thanks

par73 · Post by **par73** » 30 Jul 2013, 23:08

tirri wrote:
Also am I missing something or was tmnts best player by far (Sam) an illegal sub going by the ratings?

Offical Ruling as per Rules:

New Sub Rules: (Posted Pre-DE1)
A 5 baller is now considered a 5 baller if they were ranked 4.6 or greater on the player substitute list.
A 4 baller is now considered if they were ranked 4.0-4.5
A 3 baller is any player in the 3.0-3.9 range
A 2 baller is any player in the 2.0-2.9 range
A 1 baller is any player ranked 1.9 or below.

A 5 baller can only be subbed for a 4 baller or lower
A 4 baller can only be subbed for a 3 baller or lower
A 3 baller can be subbed for any player ranked 3 balls or less
2 and 1 ballers may now be allowed to be subbed for 3 ballers.

In addition: Any player can play for The Blades as long as its cool with them.

Sam is ranked 4.3

The only possible players Sam could have subbed for (as a 4 baller) in the entire tournament are:
GKG (TMNT)
4.8
Adren (TMNS)
4.6
East Wind (TMNT)
4.6
[Rightfully Because TMNS deserves one handicap while TMNT deserves two in comparison to Agents]

The two players he could have subbed for that were on TMNT, GKG and EW, were present during every game (as was sam).
http://games.gateofstorms.net/tournamen ... rounds/269

Adren was not present, therefore sam could have legally subbed for adren without question.

therefore sam required permission to sub for TMNT, perhaps this was granted permission by TMNS but who really knows, I'm sure you would have if you stuck around!
Was TMNT granted permission to use sam as a sub?

I need to know if this is going to be disputed or not

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 30 Jul 2013, 23:20

wwo wrote:
adrenaline wrote:Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.
I'm not disagreeing.

You might not remember fully, but I hosted a desert fr game with pretty much all good players right before Agents' 4pm DE2 match. You and chron were N against me and Asmo, and I think the only unit difference was y'all were +1 pus. South was the real action, with me and chron mirroring each other to either give an advantage mid or stop a disadvantage N. Either way, at least twice you and Asmo were faced off with neglible unit difference. At no time did you try to push, and it would've been stupid for him to do so considering your terrain defensive advantage. At the end of the game (we won), you said it was boring. Couldn't you have tried to do something to (a) make it less boring or (b) treat it like a 1v1 and probably given your team an increasingly needed boost? Or was Asmo that intimidating?

http://games.gateofstorms.net/games/8096

That's the film wwo is referring to and this happens all the time but somehow I am the delusional one. THIS is the reason you are not a 5 baller, because your awareness is far below what it should be for a player your level.

We had 3 flags first on FR and your force was equal to mine, so there was no reason for me to push when my team was winning. Even after my team tagged the south flag and we still had an equal force vs each other north you still pretty much camped even though your team needed you to make a move at that point even if it resulted in death. Instead you decided to save your ratios and all but assure that your team had 0 chance of winning.

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 30 Jul 2013, 23:26

par73 wrote:
tirri wrote:
Also am I missing something or was tmnts best player by far (Sam) an illegal sub going by the ratings?
Offical Ruling as per Rules:

New Sub Rules: (Posted Pre-DE1)
A 5 baller is now considered a 5 baller if they were ranked 4.6 or greater on the player substitute list.
A 4 baller is now considered if they were ranked 4.0-4.5
A 3 baller is any player in the 3.0-3.9 range
A 2 baller is any player in the 2.0-2.9 range
A 1 baller is any player ranked 1.9 or below.

A 5 baller can only be subbed for a 4 baller or lower
A 4 baller can only be subbed for a 3 baller or lower
A 3 baller can be subbed for any player ranked 3 balls or less
2 and 1 ballers may now be allowed to be subbed for 3 ballers.

In addition: Any player can play for The Blades as long as its cool with them.

Sam is ranked 4.3

The only possible players Sam could have subbed for (as a 4 baller) in the entire tournament are:
GKG (TMNT)
4.8
Adren (TMNS)
4.6
East Wind (TMNT)
4.6
[Rightfully Because TMNS deserves one handicap while TMNT deserves two in comparison to Agents]

The two players he could have subbed for that were on TMNT, GKG and EW, were present during every game (as was sam).
http://games.gateofstorms.net/tournamen ... rounds/269

Adren was not present, therefore sam could have legally subbed for adren without question.

therefore sam required permission to sub for TMNT, perhaps this was granted permission by TMNS but who really knows, I'm sure you would have if you stuck around!
Was TMNT granted permission to use sam as a sub?

I need to know if this is going to be disputed or not

Before this becomes an issue in anyway TMNS played 3 or 4 of the games with 8 players versus 7 without permission. So according to the rules we are both in the wrong, but tbh I think Arz for Sam is a fair sub and I think we were just unaware of their sub ratings and it seemed a non-issue.

East Wind tmnt · Post by **East Wind tmnt** » 31 Jul 2013, 00:19

No one brought up any objections to Sam being used as a sub rly. If Lord Henry tirri had objections, he could have voiced them at the appropriate time, not 3 days after the match. Also, as 'smo pointed out TMNSubs used 8.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 31 Jul 2013, 00:28

So while you, Asmodian, (representing TMNT) were aware of the 7v8 situation you simply allowed it to happen while no one on TMNS realized the rules you were breaking?

You (asmo) also realize that you (TMNT) choose to have 7 players on your roster instead of adding an imaginary player who would get a 5 ball ranking *aka chohan* so you could get another chance to legally sub for a 4 baller.

Not to mention it clearly states in the rules that both teams must agree to use substitute players in their match (so clearly you agreed for them to use 6+ players at one point or another, right?).

Meanwhile,
TMNS had 5 of their players present, which means they could have used a legal sub (and since adren wasn't present they could have used sam, legally).
Instead they chose to use Ghengis and Kryptos, Slate (4.2, 3.2 and 3.1 respectively). They legally used ghengis as a sub, and kryptos could legally have subbed for tirri, and slate for nineball.

Because you chose to use Sam (Breaking the rules by not asking permission by the way) to substitute illegally for Arzenic (lol seriously? is that fair anyway?), it makes their team be down by -2 players (which allows them for an override and could have used Ghengis as well as Sam). Even if you had used a legal sub (Kryptos and Slate were present and could have been legally used), the override would have allowed TMNS to play Ghengis and Sam, as well as Slate [The override simply states, the team can use AT LEAST ONE PLAYER to bulk up their roster, with no restriction on ball ratings]. Therefore Kryp or Slate should have been playing for TMNT, and Sam and Ghengis (or kryp, or slate) should have been playing for TMNS, IN ALL FAIRNESS IN REGARDS TO THE RULES.

More importantly TMNT shouldn't have even picked up a subsitute player being down arz while the other team has one less player from their roster, which pretty much put TMNT in a situation where the integrity of the 3-1-2 match between them and TMNS can now be disputed if TMNS decides to dispute it.

Meanwhile no one from TMNS has said anything about it until now. I have reason to believe that if Zak was present he would have caught on and not allowed this. tirri and adren aren't that stupid either.

So pretty much everything factors against TMNT in this ruling, including overall w-t-l record and the fact that the substitute rules don't support teams that choose to use less than the maximum possible players per game, per team with prejudice over ones that do.
At no time would it have been possible for TMNS to allow TMNT a -2 override unless they had asked to use 8 players (3 substitutes), which would make little to no sense, and at the very chance have a less possibility of a chance for them to show up with 5 and 3 subs and initiate the override that comes with having a -2 advantage in players.

Myrk · Post by **Myrk** » 31 Jul 2013, 00:39

So much in-depth analysis over something noone cares about.

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 00:51

Myrk wrote:So much in-depth analysis over something noone cares about.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 31 Jul 2013, 00:57

well i thought gkg was a responsible captain and player
he wouldn't let me cheat in his tournament so why should i let him cheat in mine

not to mention he needs everyone to read the rules in his tournament and follow them

asmo you're offically off the MWC staff because its been almost 7 weeks of active tournament time and you still have clearly not read or understood the rules.
At the beginning of the tournament you didn't like the subsitute system because you thought people would abuse it, well now not only did you abuse it but you did not fufill your responsibilities of a MWC staff member. Thanks for your help, goodbye.

Looks like Agents will be facing TMNS this weekend, Fallback at 2pm Sunday while TMNT will be playing Deer at 2pm Sunday.

It's funny, this all works out because TMNT requested to play Agents at 2pm anyway and Agents most likely cannot play earlier than the fallback because we are employed citizens of our country, and now will be forced to agree with TMNS's requested time because TMNS got fucked in the ass last week by TMNT's scheduling.

Myrk · Post by **Myrk** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:08

Giant Killer General · Post by **Giant Killer General** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:08

this thread is gold.

well done 'smo.

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:15

We get to play Deer? Now my ratios can be as good as Adrenaline and Captain. I have finally found out how to be a great myther!

par73 · Post by **par73** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:16

gkg and myrk ~we find it hilarious we have to play deer (waste time) this weekend because we illegally subbed to have a better team than we put together.

chances are you will lose to zomg (again) and land 4th place now.

gkg jun 2013 "I wanted the most fair, balanced roster I could get, in terms of keeping the tournament fair"

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:40

wwo wrote:
adrenaline wrote:Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.
I'm not disagreeing.

You might not remember fully, but I hosted a desert fr game with pretty much all good players right before Agents' 4pm DE2 match. You and chron were N against me and Asmo, and I think the only unit difference was y'all were +1 pus. South was the real action, with me and chron mirroring each other to either give an advantage mid or stop a disadvantage N. Either way, at least twice you and Asmo were faced off with neglible unit difference. At no time did you try to push, and it would've been stupid for him to do so considering your terrain defensive advantage. At the end of the game (we won), you said it was boring. Couldn't you have tried to do something to (a) make it less boring or (b) treat it like a 1v1 and probably given your team an increasingly needed boost? Or was Asmo that intimidating?

I actually remember this game... in fact, thanks to GoS game filtering, I just found and watched it. We were N and you guys had the W start... I actually did try to push across a couple times but he kept retreating to that hill. He also had +1 puss advantage and more mellee, yet I was the aggressor and he just continued to camp on that hill around the flag. His units: 3 warrs, 2 thrall, 3 bows, 1 dorf, 2 ghols (1 pussless) vs. my 2 warrs, 3 bows, 1 dorf... fighting uphill. On flat terrain, hell yes I would have gone for it, but it would just be suicide uphill unless he miraculously threw a puss dud and a couple dorf duds.

http://games.gateofstorms.net/games/8096

There's the game... have a look for yourself. Sorry wwo, bad example

OH i see asmo talked some rdm shit about this game, too. Well... whatev... the above statement still holds true. p.s. you are an idiot, but this thread is gold. truly it is the only thing that got me through a boring day of work, so thx 4 that at least.

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:55

I had 1 puss. I did have 1 more warrior but other than that the units were the same.

Edit: too be exact I had 2 more thrall if we are counting our flag D, the rest is the same.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 01:57

there are quite clearly 2 ghols there, and 2 thrall on flag.

Flatline · Post by **Flatline** » 31 Jul 2013, 02:55

SUGGEST WE CONTEST OUR MATCH RESULT DUE TO BLATANT CHEATING BY TEAM GKG

Myrk · Post by **Myrk** » 31 Jul 2013, 03:48

Better change your tampon paris

Homer · Post by **Homer** » 31 Jul 2013, 04:00

8 pgs good work

wwo · Post by **wwo** » 31 Jul 2013, 04:45

Yeah, I couldn't remember the exact units. On those splits I tend to like 1 to be extra war/pus and the other guy get the dorf. I misremembered which one of us had the dorf. But the other point still stands, no? Your team was losing and becoming more likely to lose with every second. Your team needed a badass play to be made and you just said you weren't the one to do it. It wasn't a guaranteed suicide by any means; you didn't even try.

adrenaline wrote:
wwo wrote:
adrenaline wrote:Anyone who doesn't think 1v1 skills find their way into 2-team games is just... wrong.
I'm not disagreeing.

You might not remember fully, but I hosted a desert fr game with pretty much all good players right before Agents' 4pm DE2 match. You and chron were N against me and Asmo, and I think the only unit difference was y'all were +1 pus. South was the real action, with me and chron mirroring each other to either give an advantage mid or stop a disadvantage N. Either way, at least twice you and Asmo were faced off with neglible unit difference. At no time did you try to push, and it would've been stupid for him to do so considering your terrain defensive advantage. At the end of the game (we won), you said it was boring. Couldn't you have tried to do something to (a) make it less boring or (b) treat it like a 1v1 and probably given your team an increasingly needed boost? Or was Asmo that intimidating?
I actually remember this game... in fact, thanks to GoS game filtering, I just found and watched it. We were N and you guys had the W start... I actually did try to push across a couple times but he kept retreating to that hill. He also had +1 puss advantage and more mellee, yet I was the aggressor and he just continued to camp on that hill around the flag. His units: 3 warrs, 2 thrall, 3 bows, 1 dorf, 2 ghols (1 pussless) vs. my 2 warrs, 3 bows, 1 dorf... fighting uphill. On flat terrain, hell yes I would have gone for it, but it would just be suicide uphill unless he miraculously threw a puss dud and a couple dorf duds.

http://games.gateofstorms.net/games/8096

There's the game... have a look for yourself. Sorry wwo, bad example

OH i see asmo talked some rdm shit about this game, too. Well... whatev... the above statement still holds true. p.s. you are an idiot, but this thread is gold. truly it is the only thing that got me through a boring day of work, so thx 4 that at least.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 05:03

you need to realize that this was a rabble game and there is a high probability that i was drunk and an even higher probability that i really didn't give a shit

just to be clear:

my only chance of success there would have been to get the mellee advantage or to somehow kill his dorf while keeping mine alive... to do that I would have had to push uphill vs his dorf, more mellee, bows, and a puss. I don't care who you are... that is guaranteed suicide unless he happened to miss/dud the puss and his dorf happened to dud 3x in a row... and even then, still gotta dodge the bows and avoid getting rushed coming up the hill. If i had a puss still, I definitely would have gone for it... but that was not the case.

either way, my intention was never to attack that flag, even though i did attempt to press a couple of times.. Honestly, I was hoping you'd stay N with asmo and the 2 of you would try to push through. I told chron to go mid, hoping the extra firepower would help us win mid or would allow someone to shift S and we'd be able to take N together later in the game. That did not work out... c'est la vie.

sasper · Post by **sasper** » 31 Jul 2013, 15:30

Flatline ~2 baller

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 17:07

I still do not understand why you are think I had 2 puss, I definetly had one and I counter pussed yours with mine and had 0 puss after that point just like you. Your best chance would have been to try and win an archer fight, which would allow you to push me back. The problem there is you could not and can not because I am 4 balls.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 17:18

there was a 2nd ghol there, which I had to assume had puss. Could not? Can not? Surely you remember our many 1v1s. How'd those go for you? Did you even win 1 game? Were any of them even remotely close? There is nothing in this game that I can't do better than you, other than perhaps make troll posts... you've done well in that department.

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 17:27

2t = different than 1vs1. Usually less units per player in 2t games. 2t---> Micro 1v1--->Macro

I'm sure CU can explain this to you. After all NC has seemed to lose their touch once he stopped playing, maybe he can help you guys get back to your winning ways with some great tips.

Edit: my "2nd" ghol that you are referring to is the ghol that counter pussed yours but ended up living.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 17:37

well i'm not at home right to check, but I'm certain there was a 2nd ghol... one up on the side of the hill beside the flag. maybe it belonged to someone else... i dunno... but pretty sure it was there. I believe I even commented in the game about it, asking why you weren't pushing me with more mellee and more puss.

oh, and there is nothing "macro" about a 1v1 bow fight... dunno how you could even try to make that argument with a straight face.

Cutard · Post by **Cutard** » 31 Jul 2013, 18:41

Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses, making a very good team involves accurately recognizing what the players offer and putting them in spots that they belong. I learned quickly that you cannot put an overall good player in a role that doesn't fit them and hope they just blossom. Another annoying thing is most players will not freely admit to what they're not so hot at, so it's on you to figure it out. In Adren's case, he is not someone who we had run around the map much calling out plays, he's just not that type of player. He is extremely good at holding a position and has been a top tier unit handler for a very long time. He was a major reason for NC winning its first tournament because of his trowing vs tirri, and I think at the time nearly everyone thought he was a fringe 3-4 baller. He also has a good grasp of strategy and has offered up very solid plans, something which most players are not capable of at all. He's also probably the most loyal and consistently motivated player that NC has had. And he is also by far the worst poster NC has ever had as well.

Anyway, adren is not a BC wrecking ball, I don't know how he got that reputation. He's more of a gimped African war elephant with an advanced case of glaucoma.

I don't know why I typed all of that.

Im summation, karma is really really bad at warrior melee packs, and so is ghengis. Maybe ghengis isn't that bad anymore, but he was!

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 18:48

I can't tell if that was a compliment or an insult... soooo fuck/thank you. lol.

I was considered a 4 baller by most (including you) in 2007, so I think I'd probably solidified that by 2009 lol.

I don't entirely agree with the worst poster bit, though... I've posted many great articles, and a few terrible ones... which I suppose are slightly overshadowed by my attraction to flame bait. FUCK YOU I CAN'T CONTROL MYSELF.

tirri · Post by **tirri** » 31 Jul 2013, 20:37

Ill just post this here sine I dont want to take over the scheduling thread. Crun said there that tmns allowed Sam to sub.

Actually Sam was bragging in the lobby before the match about how both teams wanted him to sub for them. To this I replied that actually Sam wasnt our first choice in subs, ghengis was and that he couldnt sub for tmnt because of the rules. I then had to go afk and cant be held responsible for not being there to supervise tmnt and keep on telling them to not break the rules.

The subbing system is fine but it gets ridiiculous if you can make your team better with subs. Sam was literally the best player by far for tmnt going by ratios. But its all good, following tmnts lead, we can easily sub in ghengis for some lesser player and still have me and adren play, that is unless rules arent enforced now and tmns stays in top bracket

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 20:49

You joined the game, saw Sam was on our team and left without saying anything about Sam not being able to sub. Terrible lie tirri, I'm disappointed in you.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 20:50

I don't see how no one saying anything = consent

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 20:57

We didn't "consent" your teams choice to play 8 players either [BREAKING THE RULES] but you don't see tmnt trying to get your team punished for that. Everyone who was in the game playing was clearly fine playing the games that took place. This is pretty shocking to me that this argument is coming from the people that were not even at the match (oh wait it's not, this is myth 2 we are talking about).

Grow a set and take your loss like a man. You can have another chance at us in the finals if you are so confident that you would win with yourself and tirri there.

tirri · Post by **tirri** » 31 Jul 2013, 21:00

If I was preoccupied to play or observe, I certainly didnt have the patience to start questioning you on who was going to sub and who. as observing and what not. I just checked the match records lster and saw that rules had indeed been broken.

Guys I know getting caught cheating is embarrassing and I feel sorry for you. and you were even fallback abusing before cheating, my oh my. but lets just put this behind us and I know tmns will beat you fair and square next time we meet, probably with ghengis subbimg for us just for funsies

Asmodian · Post by **Asmodian** » 31 Jul 2013, 21:03

We didn't "consent" your teams choice to play 8 players either [BREAKING THE RULES]

No response to that? seems pretty hypocritical to accuse only one team of cheating when your own team cheated as well.

but lets just put this behind us and I know tmns will beat you fair and square next time we meet, probably with ghengis subbimg for us just for funsies

sounds great, as long as there is no zoom x64 involved.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 21:12

oh i don't really give a shit about the sub thing, was just pointing out that silence does not equal consent. and i was unaware of the 8 player thing until now... pretty hillus!

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 31 Jul 2013, 22:59

Regardless of the "legality" of any of this (and let's not pretend the rules are particularly well-defined), it's stupid to try and get the game result overturned after the fact. In this case, silence pretty much does mean consent. In the same was as its the opposing captain's responsibility to ensure that all of the players are using the correct accounts, it's a similar responsibility to check subs. If you had an issue you should have voiced it at the time. This is honestly one of the more minor infractions compared to the teams almost entirely composed of subs in other matches.

There were some questionable subs happening in QR too, so frankly I think the whole tournament needs to be replayed from the beginning. Although maybe I should have waited until after the finals to bring that up.

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 31 Jul 2013, 23:17

i asked around and apparently rab had no idea that he was giving units out to 8 ppl... guess that shit is bound to happen once in a while when you have 9 ppl join you. doesn't sound like anybody even really noticed.

East Wind tmnt · Post by **East Wind tmnt** » 31 Jul 2013, 23:30

paris is a genius