REVITALIZING MYTH >> AN IDEA!

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 09 Jan 2014, 21:23

Actually surprised nobody has thought of this...

The basic idea is to create a gaming fan forum kind of thing that isn't for JUST Myth...

I mean... if it were able to attract a variety of active old gaming enthusiasts from other active communities... perhaps it would spark some cross-pollination?

So ya... a VINTAGE PC GAMING forum (or maybe just RTS games??), with subforums for a bunch of games... it would take some marketing... people with knowledge... a dedicated admin to maintain it... etc. That does not describe myself... just throwing this out there hoping someone might like the idea enough to run with it.

Not so simple an idea perhaps... but... an idea, nonetheless.

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 09 Jan 2014, 22:56

Interesting idea. Definitely personally sharing our enthusiasm with other folks about Myth is the way to get others to play.

Assuming such things already exist (they must, no? What about GoG forums or similar?) why not just get a bunch of us to join and start contributing there though? It's hard to imagine building a community around just talking about old games from scratch vs. participating in ones that already exist.

BIG KROK V8 SS · Post by **BIG KROK V8 SS** » 10 Jan 2014, 00:50

Someone draw it up and I'll make it happen. I have connections now.

empy · Post by **empy** » 10 Jan 2014, 12:31

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 10 Jan 2014, 16:15

the idea is to tap into existing communities... surely there are still people that play games like Red Alert, Age of Empires, Total War, etc etc. Anyways, was just an idea... I don't have the time or resources to do much more than write a few sentences about it lol... hoping someone else will show the initiative!

BIG KROK V8 SS · Post by **BIG KROK V8 SS** » 10 Jan 2014, 23:04

How about Bungie games in general? There is a cult following Bungie because of obvious reasons, and if people discover who actually created this game, could spark some interest. Problem is, today's youth is hard to convert to go backwards.... all they want is special effects.

killerking · Post by **killerking** » 11 Jan 2014, 17:12

https://www.facebook.com/pages/For-Carn ... 48?fref=ts

You guys should do something with this.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 14 Jan 2014, 03:29

they never participate in anything and usually just have an attitude towards everyone who strictly plays myth 2. very closed in-group.

they also kick me from all their games because i just knock through 3 or 4 players and win the game every time on 12 man ffas.

i think the real key here is figuring out a way to get other communities a) interested in our community b) interested in myth 2

perhaps the best way to approach this is not by communities but smaller groups of people, which might be more difficult to find but are probably more likely to stay.

it is seldom to see an account with a post count of 1 ever draw an attention in other forums or communities.

who know, maybe if more people from this community approached fcaw they would start getting involved.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 14 Jan 2014, 03:32

http://www.gamespot.com/forums/pc-mac-d ... -27155618/

http://ontario.kijiji.ca/
^--- no one is selling myth 2 on that website, someone could always 'sell myth 2'

what about the stupid vendors on amazon?

par73 · Post by **par73** » 14 Jan 2014, 03:36

oh stupid vendors on amazon overprice this game out the asshole
check this out
"Myth Worlds" which includes TFL and M2 and some plugins from 2000

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new

good lord

http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref=sr_ ... 1389670364
m2 for 43 dollars, oh i'll be ordering mine today.

some critics of m2:
http://www.amazon.com/Myth-Total-Codex- ... ewpoints=1
LOL too bad most of these critics are from 2000 and not 2014

browning · Post by **browning** » 14 Jan 2014, 06:29

First, the camera system. What the hell were they thinking, having the scrolling direction dependent on the camera's current angle? That's the most messed-up control I've ever seen. Second, the lack of any sort of mechanism for morale. While your dwarves and bowmen will flee a melee, every soldier whose primary purpose is hand-to-hand combat will always fight to the death. This is completely unrealistic. Third, your units never grow fatigued. A soldier who's just lopped the heads off a dozen zombies will run as fast and swing more effectively (thanks to the veteran unit mechanism) than one who's been hiding since the battle started.

lol

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 14 Jan 2014, 15:32

par73 wrote: http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new

$457.01????? What the fuck? Has this game become a fucking rare collectors item?

adrenaline · Post by **adrenaline** » 14 Jan 2014, 15:33

"The only reason not to buy this title is fairly steep system requirements. If you want to play this game competitively, you need at least a 300 mhz processor, 64 megs of RAM, 600 megs of hard disk space, and a good graphics card."

LOL wow... how things have changed.

HeadHunterKC · Post by **HeadHunterKC** » 14 Jan 2014, 20:56

lol at these prices and reviews.

on subject - I've tried to raise interest on the bungie.net forums in the past with little success, but it's worth bumping.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 19 Jan 2014, 01:18

bring back ranking and order features please
its the only way to rebuild this mess

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 19 Jan 2014, 07:42

adrenaline wrote:Actually surprised nobody has thought of this...

The basic idea is to create a gaming fan forum kind of thing that isn't for JUST Myth...

I mean... if it were able to attract a variety of active old gaming enthusiasts from other active communities... perhaps it would spark some cross-pollination?

So ya... a VINTAGE PC GAMING forum (or maybe just RTS games??), with subforums for a bunch of games... it would take some marketing... people with knowledge... a dedicated admin to maintain it... etc. That does not describe myself... just throwing this out there hoping someone might like the idea enough to run with it.

Not so simple an idea perhaps... but... an idea, nonetheless.

Well I had my steam group, nobody really supported that idea even though its pretty much dominating the gaming industry....

vigor · Post by **vigor** » 19 Jan 2014, 12:17

These guys are keeping Warcraft 2 still running. Check it out.

http://server.war2.ru

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 19 Jan 2014, 13:24

vigor wrote:These guys are keeping Warcraft 2 still running. Check it out.

http://server.war2.ru

warcraft has a huge backing by wow, lots of players backtrack to see what the story was and stuff so slightly not in the same boat.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 19 Jan 2014, 15:59

im pretty sure wow had a huge backing by warcraft before vice versa

how is your steam group dominating the gaming industry?

you mean in regards to myth groups still active or something?

BIG KROK V8 SS · Post by **BIG KROK V8 SS** » 19 Jan 2014, 16:08

I always wondered what exactly Myth 2 Worlds was. Was it just Take 2's spin off for combining the games into theirs?

toxyn · Post by **toxyn** » 19 Jan 2014, 18:45

Hrm, those copies are probably so expensive because, as far as I know, there haven't been new/official copies available for years. If you have real Myth/Myth2 CDs sitting in a closet somewhere, make sure it's ok. It might be considered a collectible item and worth $$ now...? lol, who knows

Anyway, apparently it's impossible but -- these are what Myth needs for a "revitalization" imo:

A) Find a new developer/group to purchase the rights (seriously, what are they worth at this point?). After that, sell it on places like Steam, Mac App Store and begin working on a new entry to the series. Revitalizing the series is a hard sell to a major publisher as things sit right now. However, if it's possible to buy the rights, an indie developer/group could have a high ceiling if they were to begin reselling fresh copies of previous entries online as noted above and begin work (and good marketing) on a new game to reboot the series. That's a couple of big if's. This is sort of along the lines of what Renwood wanted to ultimately do, but understandably, there's lacking support for him from within the community. *waits for email from Renwood*

-- or --

B) Open source the game. Probably not the best option (unless someone wants to build a new Myth -- or take Myth2 and make it look modern -- and give it away for free/donations), but why not if the series is dead anyway?

Renwood · Post by **Renwood** » 19 Jan 2014, 19:03

Say somebody made all new counterparts or doppelgangers for each and every myth unit.
What exactly would be the point? RTT proved to be a dead end in the RTS tree. Unless there is massive amounts of funding to make production happen. Even then people would not be happy with a 95% perfect port of myth. They bitch and moan about the small changes in the Myth updates.

If anybody has a few million laying around though. Our team would make it happen ~8^)

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 19 Jan 2014, 21:43

par73 wrote:im pretty sure wow had a huge backing by warcraft before vice versa

how is your steam group dominating the gaming industry?

you mean in regards to myth groups still active or something?

No it goes more like that the user base is one of the highest in the world , and its one of the best way to quickly source players into a group for a game that does not have its own platform, steam is a platform where players can form friend lists, invite to games ect.

http://www.joystiq.com/2014/01/15/steam ... -dev-days/

This may be of interest too

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/article ... he-Bolt-II
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/vi ... ns-in-2014

My group may not be the most popular but it can invite members fast, and direct them quickly to the desired links, showcase gameplay vids ect. The future is steam and most games even Skyrim now install steam software in order to run.

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 19 Jan 2014, 22:48

toxyn wrote: Find a new developer/group to purchase the rights (seriously, what are they worth at this point?). After that, sell it on places like Steam, Mac App Store and begin working on a new entry to the series.

If you want the long tale, check out the numerous threads at the PM forums, but suffice it to say this has been tried by various groups several times. The issue is that Bungie at one point showed interest in re-acquiring the rights, thus pushing the potential price into the stratosphere. Last I heard they aren't even interested in talking if you're not offering in the 6 figures range. Other strategies like getting rights to distribute just Myth 2 (not the franchise) have been tried to but met with no more success. There's really just nothing in it for Take 2 to even bother with, and any amount of money we could reasonably come up with is small beans and would never be earned back by any viable business.

But yeah, I agree that either of your ideas would be fine. Hell even just being able to let people download the full game legally (from PM or GoS or somewhere we can advertise) would be better than nothing. Unfortunately, technically this is still all Take 2's property so the ball is in their court...

As people have said, the most viable path is for an indy to just make a Myth-like game but not call it Myth. Going after the actual rights is far more trouble than it is worth at this point.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 20 Jan 2014, 02:10

punkUser wrote:
toxyn wrote: Find a new developer/group to purchase the rights (seriously, what are they worth at this point?). After that, sell it on places like Steam, Mac App Store and begin working on a new entry to the series.
If you want the long tale, check out the numerous threads at the PM forums, but suffice it to say this has been tried by various groups several times. The issue is that Bungie at one point showed interest in re-acquiring the rights, thus pushing the potential price into the stratosphere. Last I heard they aren't even interested in talking if you're not offering in the 6 figures range. Other strategies like getting rights to distribute just Myth 2 (not the franchise) have been tried to but met with no more success. There's really just nothing in it for Take 2 to even bother with, and any amount of money we could reasonably come up with is small beans and would never be earned back by any viable business.

But yeah, I agree that either of your ideas would be fine. Hell even just being able to let people download the full game legally (from PM or GoS or somewhere we can advertise) would be better than nothing. Unfortunately, technically this is still all Take 2's property so the ball is in their court...

As people have said, the most viable path is for an indy to just make a Myth-like game but not call it Myth. Going after the actual rights is far more trouble than it is worth at this point.

To be honest, fuck Take 2, fuck bungie and just distribute to everyone until word of mouth gets around more often about this game to make the unlikely situation for someone to pay attention to it.

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 20 Jan 2014, 05:59

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I always wondered what exactly Myth 2 Worlds was. Was it just Take 2's spin off for combining the games into theirs?

Probably just Take 2 trying to squeeze some more sales out of Myth. Bundle MII with some fan-made plugins and market all over again.

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 20 Jan 2014, 06:48

I only see 2 ways to go to increase Myth-ing legally.

1) Find a cheap/free 3D engine (Myth's needs are pretty modest), make a Myth-alike. That's a LOT of hours, and a lot of testing.

2) Instead of buying MII rights from Take Two (foolishly over-priced), try to get a cheap, short-term, renewable, limited license to sell/distribute. Give Take Two a cut of any profits (so they'll grant license cheaply). We'd probably still have to come up with enough $ to cover their legal expenses in drawing-up the deal. What would that be? I dunno. $5K? $10K?

Of course, drunken_deer's plan is pretty good too

Chohan · Post by **Chohan** » 20 Jan 2014, 18:53

>People are still so retarded they think the rights to myth2 are needed to give the game to others.

>upload torrent
>post link of torrent

dat was hard mayne

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 20 Jan 2014, 22:31

Chohan wrote: >upload torrent
>post link of torrent

Yeah cause that's entirely the problem... there has always been a way to get it if you look around enough, but there's a big difference between that and having it on the Steam or GoG store.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 26 Jan 2014, 13:28

punkUser wrote:
Chohan wrote: >upload torrent
>post link of torrent
Yeah cause that's entirely the problem... there has always been a way to get it if you look around enough, but there's a big difference between that and having it on the Steam or GoG store.

Yeh but you can cry as much as you like, those greedy sons of bitches are not going to assist in getting more players for this game. Only way its going to happen is through people like me
and others who are willing to get their hands dirty for the sake of keeping myth alive even for a few seconds more.

Perhaps if players joined and actively tried to get more people on board in my group, instructing how to obtain, patch and secure a registered account (being a long procedure) and doing it correctly we may
actually reach the 16 player mark in some good games other than mazz style coops.

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 26 Jan 2014, 16:21

drunken_deer wrote:Perhaps if players joined and actively tried to get more people on board in my group, instructing how to obtain, patch and secure a registered account (being a long procedure) and doing it correctly we may actually reach the 16 player mark in some good games other than mazz style coops.

You mean the Steam group? Once we join, how do you suggest we actively try to get more people on board?

>"instructing how to obtain, patch and secure a registered account"

I am working on something along those lines, and some ideas on publicizing Myth more, but it will take a week or several before I'll have anything to unveil.

In the meantime, it sounds like bungie.net's FCAW group is worthwhile to join (they have FB group too). They focus on old Bungie games, they invade Myth periodically, and 1 current Myth-er (Silent) is working on instructional videos to help tutor and coax in some Marathon players.

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 27 Jan 2014, 00:39

drunken_deer wrote:secure a registered account (being a long procedure)

Yeah, signing up for a forum is so much harder than Facebook or any other site that everyone seems to be able to figuire out fine...

Besides, the entire point is that you don't have to sign up for a registered account! Why would you even add this extra step for new players when there is literally no need?

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 27 Jan 2014, 01:17

punkUser wrote:Yeah, signing up for a forum is so much harder than Facebook or any other site that everyone seems to be able to figuire out fine...

I assumed deer was being thorough, but that the hard parts were the 1st two...obtaining the game, and getting it all patched, detail textures, config for GoS, etc.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 27 Jan 2014, 04:27

jason_ac wrote:
punkUser wrote:Yeah, signing up for a forum is so much harder than Facebook or any other site that everyone seems to be able to figuire out fine...
I assumed deer was being thorough, but that the hard parts were the 1st two...obtaining the game, and getting it all patched, detail textures, config for GoS, etc.

the hard parts are the first two, but signing up for a random forum can also be a deterrent, for spyware, adds and other junk you do not want in your e-mail.
Not to mention the fact that you still have that dumb-ass 24 trow value that no newbie will ever know.

Just saying, may not be hard but every time a site asks me to register I usually close it off.

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 27 Jan 2014, 04:55

drunken_deer wrote: Just saying, may not be hard but every time a site asks me to register I usually close it off.

Like I said, you don't have to register at all here. I don't see how you can possibly complain about the situation at GoS. It could not be easier as far as the site goes.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 27 Jan 2014, 10:42

punkUser wrote:
drunken_deer wrote: Just saying, may not be hard but every time a site asks me to register I usually close it off.
Like I said, you don't have to register at all here. I don't see how you can possibly complain about the situation at GoS. It could not be easier as far as the site goes.

There are currently 3 major issues at the moment Punkuser that have been posted in this thread in the past 6 months or brought up regularly, disputed priorities but lets put it this way

1. Ranking
2. Guests
3. More players

Whatever order you put them in, Guests are an abomination to the myth community, destroy ranked games and creates a no-name user that confuses regular players to include them in games.
Everyone wants more players, having them as Guests gets them into the game easier, true but you get them lazy and people can not tell the difference between a trolling player and a newbie.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 27 Jan 2014, 15:19

making an account is the first step to building/rebuilding an identity on this game for some players.

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 27 Jan 2014, 16:24

drunken_deer wrote:Guests are an abomination to the myth community, destroy ranked games and creates a no-name user that confuses regular players to include them in games. Everyone wants more players, having them as Guests gets them into the game easier, true but you get them lazy and people can not tell the difference between a trolling player and a newbie.

I am against guests. I see no reason to keep it. If anyone can go through all the disparate steps to get Myth, patch it, try it, decide they want to go online, change their MP to GoS, and get online...they can handle the extra step of registering (perhaps change the CAPTCHA so it's no longer about Trow trading). I see guests primarily abused as a way for assholes to troll other people. If everyone had to register, there'd be a bit more control over trolls. And wouldn't we rather new people see an identifiable community of people that have to answer somewhat for their actions, vs a community with too many trolling guests?

par73 · Post by **par73** » 27 Jan 2014, 16:36

could changed the captcha to various UT questions, not just strictly trow.

one could claim the captcha is biased against traditional light-map, ww2 and raid whore players

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 27 Jan 2014, 18:06

drunken_deer wrote: Everyone wants more players, having them as Guests gets them into the game easier, true but you get them lazy and people can not tell the difference between a trolling player and a newbie.

That's why there are tournament rooms... the power is completely with the players. If you guys don't want guests, just decide (as a community or individuals or whatever) to play in those rooms. I'm open to making a tourney room w/o films if that's an issue, but judging from the fact that everyone already plays in the films room, I don't think it is.

jason_ac wrote:If everyone had to register, there'd be a bit more control over trolls.

Not really true. These days it is trivial to spoof an IP or e-mail or whatever other registration requirements there are. Requiring accounts on MariusNet never meant there were any fewer dummies. I'd rather not even bother having the 1000 Zak accounts registered frankly

And again, the power is fully with you guys. If you don't want guests, play in the other room.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 28 Jan 2014, 01:56

punkUser wrote:
drunken_deer wrote: Everyone wants more players, having them as Guests gets them into the game easier, true but you get them lazy and people can not tell the difference between a trolling player and a newbie.
That's why there are tournament rooms... the power is completely with the players. If you guys don't want guests, just decide (as a community or individuals or whatever) to play in those rooms. I'm open to making a tourney room w/o films if that's an issue, but judging from the fact that everyone already plays in the films room, I don't think it is.

jason_ac wrote:If everyone had to register, there'd be a bit more control over trolls.
Not really true. These days it is trivial to spoof an IP or e-mail or whatever other registration requirements there are. Requiring accounts on MariusNet never meant there were any fewer dummies. I'd rather not even bother having the 1000 Zak accounts registered frankly

And again, the power is fully with you guys. If you don't want guests, play in the other room.

isnt that quite dumb forcing guests in non-tournament rooms, because most registered players have been crying for ranking (hence using tournament rooms), so actual guests who are meant to participate with other players are completely isolated from the regular mythers see a empty lobby/leave and split the player community ever more?

jason_ac · Post by **jason_ac** » 28 Jan 2014, 02:44

drunken_deer wrote:isnt that quite dumb forcing guests in non-tournament rooms, because most registered players have been crying for ranking (hence using tournament rooms), so actual guests who are meant to participate with other players are completely isolated from the regular mythers see a empty lobby/leave and split the player community ever more?

It's not dumb. I'd still rather force registration, but at least PunkUser's setup is flexible. However, I'd want to review the docs for the demo & the updater, so they're clear that...there are multiple servers...they come and go...you can change them...and once you get in them, you have to know how to work room lobbies, so you actually find people. I'm pretty sure that right now the docs for both the demo & the updater are sorely lacking in those regards.

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 28 Jan 2014, 04:46

drunken_deer wrote: isnt that quite dumb ... blah blah ...

No. Also they can see the other rooms fine now, they just can't join them (and will receive a message telling them how to register when they try).

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 28 Jan 2014, 14:59

punkUser wrote:
drunken_deer wrote: isnt that quite dumb ... blah blah ...
No. Also they can see the other rooms fine now, they just can't join them (and will receive a message telling them how to register when they try).

If I had a dollar for every excuse you made Punkuser, I might actually be able to donate enough for you to do something about it.

par73 · Post by **par73** » 28 Jan 2014, 16:28

he's a revitializing myth idea: play in The Winter Series 2014

punkUser · Post by **punkUser** » 28 Jan 2014, 22:56

drunken_deer wrote: If I had a dollar for every excuse you made Punkuser

If you'd prefer that I just don't respond to silly statements vs. explaining I'd be happy to do that instead, just let me know. Frankly me telling you that you're wrong and why isn't an "excuse", it's a courtesy. There are definitely cases where there's wiggle room and opinions involved and thus space for discussion, but this isn't one of them so let's move on.

drunken_deer · Post by **drunken_deer** » 29 Jan 2014, 00:40

punkUser wrote:
drunken_deer wrote: If I had a dollar for every excuse you made Punkuser
If you'd prefer that I just don't respond to silly statements vs. explaining I'd be happy to do that instead, just let me know. Frankly me telling you that you're wrong and why isn't an "excuse", it's a courtesy. There are definitely cases where there's wiggle room and opinions involved and thus space for discussion, but this isn't one of them so let's move on.

CHACHING! dollar for you sire!