Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

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Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Giant Killer General » Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:21 pm

Since MWC has now concluded, I just wanted to briefly reflect on this tournament experience, and in particular how it relates to the current state of myth.

Overall, I would say the tourney was both good and bad. It was good in that there was relatively little drama. Some people are upset with me, but every TO has that, and it was still only a few people. It was maybe just about the lowest drama with a TO in a tourney almost ever. A lot of that is because no one really cares enough to beef anymore much these days I suppose. But I also try to prevent as much drama as possible. Some people may like the drama, but I think most don't care for it, at least as it pertains to the TO themselves.

Of course, the bad is that the tourney did not pan out quite as anyone had hoped. That has been kind of the story of myth for some time now though, hasn't it? But still, even with more conservative and dwindling expectations, the tournament still fell a bit short of what I had hoped for as well. This was mostly due to both the team rosters and the way some of the matches panned out. I had hoped Dragon Army's roster would have been a bit stronger to properly contend with my team. And I also had hoped that Dragon Army would not drop the ball against Berserkers (but props to berserkers as well for that win). I can't really control some of these things though, so I am not losing sleep over it.

There is something else I could have controlled though, which is probably the most valid criticism of my handling of things in this tournament. And that is for the tournament to have more marketing / promotional work done leading up to it starting, and having a tournament website. I still don't think this would have mattered at all, as I have never felt this has mattered for a nearly 20 year old game. I have hosted several tournaments previously, all which I would consider solid successes in their high levels of participation and quality of matches, and none of them required marketing or a website. This was the first tournament that I hosted that felt a bit "meh" to me. However, the important thing here is that there are some people that do think it matters. And there is a contingent of the community that really focuses on this issue. Some might even think the whole point of organizing a myth tournament is the promotion and the website.

Of course, I disagree. So I am unable to do this sort of work because I don't care to do it. And also because I find it highly hypocritical and irritating that the people who want or expect this sort of above-and-beyond effort the most, are also the ones that never volunteer to do it themselves. So for that reason, I will just say that the haters can rest assured that I will go ahead and disqualify myself from hosting any future tournaments. Maybe there is something valid about the marketing and the website that I am missing, who knows? I just found this disparity in expectations rather surprising in this day of myth, and wanted to mention it as a fair warning for any future TO's.

That is not the only reason I am disqualifying myself though. It isn't even the primary reason. The real main reason I am disqualifying myself now is that given the current state of myth when we can barely field 4 teams anymore, I am beginning to question the possibility of decent tournaments in the traditional format at all. I think it may be better to start thinking about all-star match formats instead, where the best 16 players that show are put into two even teams on the spot. I have been questioning this sort of thing for years already, which is why I did the first all-star match in 2015. Draft tournaments are an okay alternative solution for some people too. But that has its own set of problems as well, so that should not be the only option we are left with.

Therefore, if I have any future energies for organizing anything in myth, I will likely devote them to such all-star matches instead (either a single week, or a short series of weeks). I have kind of lost faith in the traditional formats now, but I understand that some of the myth community may not quite be there yet in their expectations. So I am happy to leave the organizing of these more traditional tournaments to whoever thinks that they are still worthwhile to do so.

Hopefully, there is someone else out there that still wants to host tournaments, with all the proper marketing and websites that some people still expect. I would be curious to see if the results are any better. Then we can find out the answer to whether it really matters or not. Whose expectations are right or wrong these days? Was this tournament weak on participation due to my lack of promotion and a website? Or was it just because it is myth in the year 2017? We won't be able to tell until the next tournament, or perhaps until the next myth world cup.

adrenaline
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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby adrenaline » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:55 am

Although I like the idea of All-Star matches, excluding all of the other players that don't meet that criteria is seriously detrimental to the longevity of this game. What would be cool is some sort of tiered system... like 4+ teams, 2 comprised of all the best players, and 2+ comprised of all the rest... where the best performers of the lower division have a chance to fight for a spot in the upper, and the worst performers in the top division get relegated to the lower division. Could base it on certain criteria... perhaps resurrecting the Wighty Score or voting for the MVPs of the match... fuck I dunno. Seems like a lot of work... but there has to be some way for us to have competitive games while still being inclusive.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Giant Killer General » Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:57 am

everyone keeps bringing up the exclusiveness thing with the all-star matches, but the last all-star match had exactly 16 people, and no one was left outside wanting to get in. When we dipped below 16 briefly, we recruited 1-2 more people from the lobbies to fill in. 2-3 newbies got to play in the games, without massively affecting them in any adverse manner because all the rest of the players were still good. It worked out well.

You have to consider how difficult it is to even get 16 players together at any specific time on the weekends these days.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby adrenaline » Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:40 am

We've seen greater numbers every weekend at fallback... 4 full teams... 2 matches of 8v8. And that's not including the few others that DA had to sit for some games. I'm not naive enough to think that 32+ people will show up every weekend, but even if, say, 24 show up (optimistic, perhaps)... that would leave 8 people in the lobby. Are those 8 people excluded less likely to show up the next weekend? Probably. But perhaps they themselves are hopeless optimists... and show up, yet again, the following weekend. They get excluded again. How likely are they now to show up each successive week? ... or perhaps ever again? People lose interest in Myth quickly when they can't ever find a game to play in... at this point I think we should be doing everything we can to keep to keep this game alive instead of looking for ways to kill it faster than its current rate of death. So yes, let's have our All-Star matches... but let's also find a way to keep everyone else's attention somehow. It would be pretty cool to see a full lobby once a week for more than just 1-2 months each year.

*Disclaimer: I use the word "we" a lot, but what I really mean is anyone other than me. Just throwing this out there hoping someone a little more energetic/outgoing will take some initiative.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Giant Killer General » Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:16 am

obviously if there was far more than 16 that showed, you could easily split it into 2 games. not that big of a deal. some games better than no games. theres really no excuse or harm done by having all-star type matches. as i said before, others are free to organize whatever format they want as well. We don't get upset about mwc finals matches being too exclusive. this is basically the same thing. And as myth continues, it's obviously going to get harder and harder to fill 16 people, so this becomes a non-issue eventually, if it isn't already. we can fill more than 16 in the dead heat of mwc once per year, but that is about it. good luck doing that any other time of year.

Phos
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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Phos » Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:10 pm

Sounds good. Good points by GKG and Adren both. I look forward to where Myth goes from here, I readily acknowledge that the pool of players has been getting small. I sometimes wonder if I can do something to make a difference there, akin to marketing. Grassroots, or internet based. I probably won't, but I haven't eliminated the possibility...

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Myrk » Tue Jul 11, 2017 1:52 am

All-star or draft type formats are the only way to make tournaments competitive/fun at this point.
As for people being excluded, there's an easy solution...if more than 16 people want to play in it, there's 2 games. Either 1 game with the higher skilled people in it and 1 with the lower skilled ones, or a mix of both. So long as both teams have reasonably competent captains and the teams are even enough to make playing the games worthwhile, who really gives a fuck.

wwo
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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby wwo » Tue Jul 11, 2017 3:33 am

We just need an incentive to show up and do kickball, since that's all this is sounding like besides one person's curation.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Captain » Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:01 pm

I always thought since most of us are grown up and making good money now, we should add some money to stir things up, I think it would increase the competition and get more people involved.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Giant Killer General » Sun Jul 16, 2017 7:21 pm

Well, despite roughly 20 people saying there was a good chance of them showing up to the all-star match scheduled for today, and many more people knowing about it as well, hardly anyone ended up showing. Maybe 10 showed, only 7-8 stayed for a few games due to the weak showing, and then we all called it quits.

So any fears of an "all-star match" (if we can even call it that anymore) being too "exclusive" should be completely squashed now. This was done right after mwc too when people are typically still around. So as I suspected, good luck even filling a 16 person game at any point in time to ever do something like this again.

People could have forgotten, or it could have just been bad luck with timing for a bunch of people. But I kind of suspect it is because people lost interest with mwc no longer on the line since I am fairly certain that Dragon Army and Roflmazzers would have had a good showing this weekend still if it was still an official mwc match. Nobody from those 2 teams said this time was a bad time for them during the finals match last weekend.

So maybe the mentality of having a tournament still matters, who knows. Someone else will have to try and figure it out though another time. I have to tap out now.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Ratking » Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:42 am

Sorry I couldn't show. I've got my hands full but I thought I could pull it off. This mwc had tough timing for me with the baby nearly full term and so many things needing attention.

I will be doing a mwc wrap up podcast at some point. I also have some ideas others may be interested in for keeping myth moving.

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Myrk » Mon Jul 17, 2017 5:06 am

Perhaps we call it a kickball draft tournament next time and the prize is Kirk sucks the winning captain's dick? That should get everyone interested

adrenaline
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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby adrenaline » Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:12 pm

I thought I'd be able to show, but I ended up being out of town for the weekend.

shinco
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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby shinco » Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:05 pm

I'd play if my fucking account would work.

shinco

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Re: Reflecting on MWC 2017 and the State of Myth

Postby Dantski » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:19 pm

you're crazy shinco


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