GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

A single berserk reached us yesterday, after having come all the way over the mountains from the city of Willow, fourteen hundred miles away. He delivered to Alric a single package the size of a man's fist, wrapped in rags, and refuses to talk with anyone about events in the West.
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GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 28 Jul 2018, 09:41

Two can play at this game Kirk :).

Just a friendly reminder for Kirk and a bit of Myth history for anyone else interested. I actually retired Kirk in 2010 in possibly the only full 1v1 series I have ever gotten him to stay and complete all the way against me. Match score was 5-3 in my favor (would have been 5-2, but I let Kirk repeat his first clash pick twice, which he won the 2nd time). Shit-talking aside, it's actually a good 1v1 series. Tirri and Kirk were my 2 toughest 1v1 opponents ever. But of course, as hard-fought as the matches were, I never lost a 1v1 tourney match (2 or 3 against Tirri) or retirement match (1 against Kirk) against either one of them.

GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match Films:
GKG vs Kirk Retirement match 2010 films.zip

Game 1:
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Game 2:
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Game 3:
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Game 4:
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Game 5:
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Game 6:
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Game 7:
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Game 8:
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Btw, I'm loving the new drama Kirk. Reminds me of old times. Might breathe some care back into the game yet - just not likely with me. But keep it up :).

I'm always available to 1v1 more Kirk. You just gotta actually stay for a proper 5 or 7 game series, instead of running away the moment you get a lead. Which kind of goes to show you who is the scared one here. I don't even actually care anymore, you might beat me yet as rusty as I am today. If only you actually had the confidence to follow through with it. But you better try it soon before I either get warmed up or quit playing. Or don't play me, I really don't care anymore. By all means, feel free to just stick to the talking and trolling. I am quite satisfied with just having my retirement match win over you back when I did actually care too :).

P.S. - For anyone wondering where this random beef is coming from seemingly out of nowhere, it's because I booted Kirk from a mazz game last weekend. Apparently, Kirk's temper-tantrums haven't changed in 8 years since I last saw them. Still as sensitive as ever.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 28 Jul 2018, 16:07

I can already tell these are fake. I wouldn't lose to you at Raid for one, and number 2, my name did not look like that back in 2010. If those are the only games you've ever beaten me at supposedly, they were not as part of a retirement match. Let me find a few to refresh your memory.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 28 Jul 2018, 16:22

As you'll see, my name was not full caps and SS until the start of 2011. Of all of these games, there is one where you 'beat me' but still lost gametype, but Myth recorded it as a victory for me. Have fun trying to remember all of these beauties. I'm sure you "forgot" about them. Seems there were too many to upload directly to here, so I've taken the time to make you a photo album so you can bring back all the memories of these losses. If you need help counting, that's 16 games.


16-0 BIG KROK V8 SS vs little sucky private

https://imgur.com/a/HfDhCrc

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 28 Jul 2018, 16:40

How silly of me, how could I have forgotten this gem? 17-0

screenshot- 2018-07-28 12.39.27.jpg

screenshot- 2018-07-28 12.39.37.jpg

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 28 Jul 2018, 18:59

You technically have lost a 1v1 tourney match if you count me beating you 5-3 for $100. Just saying.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 28 Jul 2018, 21:55

I didn't actually say that I never lost a 1v1 tourney match, because that would not be true. I said I have never lost a tourney or retirement match to Tirri or Kirk (read - "against either one of them"), who were by far the 2 best 1v1 players I have ever played (along with Chohan, but I barely played him, and never in a tourney). I have lost 1v1 tourney matches to Rabican in Shai's 1v1 tournament in 2006, Se7en Penis Rising, perhaps others prior to 2009 that I can't recall, and 1 against PK in my 1v1 tournament in 2013 (after beating him in like 5 other matches).

But I know you wanted to deliberately misread what I said, adren, to give yourself an excuse to insert yourself into the conversation by mentioning your only victory over me and only claim to fame in achieving anything in 1v1. So thanks for that. But actually, I never lost a match "for $100." "For $100" would suggest that I had something to win too. But I did not have anything to win. Only you did. Instead, I gave away $100, my winnings from a recent and actual 1v1 tournament that I won, to the first person who beat me as a token to the myth community, and just to get some more 1v1s games. I never had any intention of keeping it. I was looking to give it away. And I was confident enough of beating you that I decided to try it on 4 hours of sleep, and it was still a close match.

And how grateful of a victor you have been since then :). It is still funny to recall how scared you were to rematch me, by avoiding to play me at all again for the next 6 months as you gloated about it because you knew how lucky you were to walk away with your only win ever over me. Which is kind of reminiscent of Kirk's behavior too, actually. Just kind of goes to show you who is scared of who. It is a shame that good 1v1ers are always so scared to compete against one another just because of their egos and pride, especially this late in myth when nobody cares anymore.

If I had a chance of winning "for $100", or winning anything really like a proper 1v1 tournament, I can assure you I would have actually tried fully. With nothing for me to "win," do you really think I would care enough to be at my best? Just beating you by itself is no motivation at all for me. I have done it so many times (probably over a dozen total 1v1 series), and except that 1 match, I always have won over you. So why would I have cared? But by all means, if you would like to 1v1 "for $100," I am always available to take your money too. We both know you don't want to do that though.

And since you wanted to mention it, let's also mention the like 3 or 4 actual tournament matches I have beaten you in, including one 3-0 sweep. Just saying.

LOL

Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby LOL » 28 Jul 2018, 22:09

These are lies, GKG just couldn't possibly beat KROK in his prime. A man who got landwighted by Cu? ...c'mon man. The true all time 1v1 champ is KIRK, master of the Coonbros. He shall come with his V8 and when he does you better not prolong the inevitable.

LMAO LOLICOPTER GKG RAPED! COON COON COON!!

https://goo.gl/images/dvGRbt

https://goo.gl/images/z3Hnkm

https://goo.gl/images/4PfaUs

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 28 Jul 2018, 22:17

Well if you wanna play the 4 hrs of sleep card... I guess I could mention that 90% of the times I've played you I was either drunk or high as fuck, and also likely running on 4 hrs of sleep or less... playing casually for the hell of it, while you predictably kept track of w/l and puffed you feathers for taking a few games off me in that state. Pathetic, really. But anyways ya... keep sticking to the story that you were trying to lose $100, to me of all people. You were so fucking butthurt after that match it's laughable... definitely the behavior of someone try to lose... :roll:

And I've done plenty of things in 1v1 tourneys... sadly none of those tourneys actually finished. MFC in 2013, 2nd place.. tourney did not finish. Some other tourney before that I rolled everyone I played, waiting to play the loser of you vs tirri in the semi-finals but you guys never played your match and the tourney did not finish.

Personally, I think both Kirk and Tirri are better 1v1ers than you... at least more interesting to play. You have the most boring style I've ever seen... same trades and strats every time, like you are following a fucking recipe. Zero creativity. At least Kirk and Tirri mix it up and make things somewhat entertaining.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 28 Jul 2018, 22:27

I would never brag about beating you adren. I literally never puffed my feathers at you. When playing you, I can only ever just be quiet, roll my eyes, and brace myself for the avalanche of excuses thrown at me when I am usually just trying to play casually too. Whatever else you ever perceived was entirely in your own head. I only mention beating you after you try to cling to my balls constantly as if you were ever on my level. If I was ever going to brag about beating anyone, it would be Tirri or Kirk only, since they were at least on my level.

I agree, you were inconsistent in your 1v1s and sometimes not at your best. But it's not like you were never playing at your best either. So there's still that...

I was not trying to lose, I never said that I was. I simply said I was not at my best, just like you weren't sometimes either. And it certainly was no tournament match to me.

I don't really care who you think is better than who. I am only here to deliver the facts. I never lost a full series to either of them. Funny to be talking about strats though in 1v1 lmoth games as if they were mwc matches. Go mid and melee rush or arty fight - pretty much always the only 2 choices ever. That's kind of the point of it being a "duel." If you cared about "strat" diversity so much, I guess you should be playing 1v1s on other gametypes more often.

And yes, I am so well known to be guilty of zero creativity in my strats in myth. Makes sense :).

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 28 Jul 2018, 22:46

Painting with broad strokes, Mr. Literal. I was clearly referring to your approach to 1v1. B O R I N G.
And you can't claim whatever you want... I've beaten Kirk just as many times as he's beaten me and I'm about 50/50 with Tirri, historically. And I've beaten you enough times in random 1v1s and taken countless others down to the wire... so I'm not sure how you think I'm not "at your level". There have been many times that we'd play and I'd win 3-4 in a row, and you'd get all butthurt and be like "first to 5 wins". Ya... totally not at your level. Your just the only one that takes 1v1s super life-or-death seriously, while the rest of us play them for shits and giggles. You can talk me down all you want, but I've been regarded as a top 1v1er for a decade... whether you claim so or not. You have clearly always been biased against me... like when you seeded MFC and put me like... 6th... then I proceeded to beat everyone you had seeded above me, to nobody's surprise. Or when I was top dmg/game and ratios champ for like 4+ tournaments in a row, heavy hitting on a championship team, and you'd rate me 4 balls regardless lol. You have clearly always had something against me and it's plainly obvious.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 28 Jul 2018, 23:09

haha, yes, I know you clearly care a lot about what I think about you. The feeling is one-way, of course. Which is what this is always about between us. And it is why I can never respect you as a man. You were never your own man in myth. All of your self-perceived relevance in myth has always only ever been through me.

I did see you go 50/50 with tirri in 2013 after maybe 4 games or something? Don't think it was even a full series. By all means, I would love to see you 1v1 tirri or kirk, and then I might be able to change my opinion of your abilities. But I don't think I have ever seen it. Certainly not in any tournament match that I know of. And I doubt it will ever happen because as I said, everyone is too scared to play each other due to their pride. Did you play in the 1v1 tournament that Kirk won in 2008? If so, what was the result there against Kirk? Have you ever had any tournament matches against Tirri or Kirk? And if so, what was the result?

You are a top 1v1er. I have never disputed that. Just not THE top 1v1er. There's a difference. Kirk, Tirri, and I, are in that conversation. You are not. We all have won actual 1v1 tournaments. You have not. That's why you are not on our level.

And as far as comparing yourself to me personally, it's because I beat you so consistently, and sometimes very badly. If I had to guess my overall game win/loss record against you it would probably be about 2 wins for every 1 loss. That's not very close. So that's a pretty easy reasoning for why you are not on my level. I agree though, I think my style gives you a lot more trouble than anyone else. Probably something to do with your frustration and accusations of my style being "boring" - another defense mechanism.

You act like I am the only one that rated you 4 balls when actually you have pretty much always been the only one to ever consider yourself 5. According to your most recent ranking by the community, which I did not even participate in, your public ranking is 4.3 right now. Looks like people agree more with me than with you. Top dmg/game and ratios have never been an indicator of who is 5 balls. If that was true, we would hand out 5 balls to every person who had top dmg/game and ratios at the end of every tournament. You are a joke even for thinking that, and it's a perfect example of your flaws as a player. Again, the community's perception already agrees with me judging by your 4.3 rating (and my 4.9). So take it up with them, not me.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 29 Jul 2018, 03:18

adrenaline wrote:I've beaten Kirk just as many times as he's beaten me



Was going to back you up until you said these words in a sentence. This is just an absolute farce statement.

If you saw the films, all except 1 of them has either a pre or post excuse. The 2 PG games you INSISTED on playing me (undercover) and boxer 2v1. Notice in the Raid game, Hogan vs Splinter, Monty was keeping track of the score (10-1). Enjoy

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screenshot- 2018-07-28 23.16.44.zip
(5.01 MiB) Downloaded 9 times

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 29 Jul 2018, 03:29

100% KG Win
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Jahral dealing the burn
screenshot- 2018-03-26 22.38.55.png

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 29 Jul 2018, 04:38

Krik.. lol i totally missed that burn by Jah... not bad. Hogan vs $plinter LOL... 2007? 10-1 is HIGHLY doubtful... and without context... he could have been talking about anything. Also, Raid? That's how I know this is a joke... I do not play raid and have certainly never willingly played it 1v1. Quite possible it wasn't even me, because we both had all of the RoT account passwords. How do you even have films from back then still? I've lost my film collection like 10x over. Do you have the films from our "retirement" match in 09/10 whenever it was? 3-0 for me... in front of a full game of spectators and you dropped in the last game LOL. Shocking, I know.

GKG, I've only played Tirri once in tourney... ya it was 2-2, we didn't finish the match. I've played him several games casually though... always great games and quite fun, because Tirri plays with style and isn't predictable (he also isn't a bitch, win or lose).
And since when is being the top player on the winning team in several consecutive tournaments NOT a credential for 5 ballerdom? That hardly even makes sense.

And since you keep saying the $100 match wasn't a tournament:
http://mwc10.forumchitchat.com/post/everyoneisinthefinals1vs1tournament-4757525?&trail=20

That should end that argument, I'd think. And you came into a game and challenged ME... so this whole 4 hrs of sleep bullshit is just that... if it was a problem for you, you wouldn't have laid down the challenge.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 29 Jul 2018, 07:00

Adren, it's not a tournament for me if there is not anything for me to win. I marketed that way as a tongue-in-cheek joke so others would be more encouraged and not so scared to play me. Obviously, I had no incentive other than just to get 1v1 matches. Of course, I did not want to lose to you, but I fully expected to lose to someone eventually as the whole thing was just an excuse for me to get some 1v1 matches instead of people constantly dodging to play me. I literally wanted to give away that prize money, I never had any intent of keeping it. You apparently took it to heart as if it was a real tournament and have clung onto it ever since because it is convenient for your ego.

Me joining a game and challenging you, was actually just a result of you saying earlier that you would play me eventually (your link even shows you replying "sign me up" soon after I announced it). However, you kept on delaying, apparently waiting for some "perfect moment" to finally play me. I had to pull your teeth for a solid week or two before you finally relented to play. By the time you finally played me, I was fully frustrated by how scared everyone was in still being by dodging me. And yes, sorry to keep breaking it to you, but your most important match win apparently was over an opponent on just 4 hours of sleep. Apparently, I was on some level trying to sabotage myself because I was so frustrated with people still dodging me, and I wanted it to be over. If I didn't lose to you, I would have lost to someone else eventually. Even after winning, you still dodged me for at least 6 months - a testament to your confidence in your own ability to repeat your success. I knew you would gloat with your win, as you had every right to. But even I underestimated how much emotional stock you would put in that win in all the years since, even after all the other times you have kept losing to me since then.

If anything that whole event that I hosted with my prize money was a remarkable experiment in how much people treasure their egos and pride over money, even in computer games. All this gloating, shit-talking, and trolling between the top 1v1 players about who beat who does nothing but to make everyone scared to even play against each other because they will all take any loss and hold it over each other's heads forever no matter how brief, casual, old, or otherwise irrelevant the loss is. It would have been great if I could have kept hosting 1v1 events with prize money to the first person who beat me, or if others could host other similar events. But your behavior, and others like it, have guaranteed that such things clearly cannot ever exist.

This was one of the main reasons I respected Chohan so much. He was a true champion in this regard by fearlessly playing everyone in the biggest tournament, prize, retirement, or grudge matches. He is the only other player I have seen that exhibited this type of fearless attitude outside of myself. Everyone else I have seen (you, Kirk, Tirri, and nearly everyone else) has been scared to 1v1 me or each other at various times. I don't think any of you can say the same about me. If anything, I recklessly jumped into hosting 1v1 events and various 1v1 matches to give everyone else more opportunities than they deserved to try and beat me. That small event was one example of that. And also unlike you or Kirk, I at least knew when to stop gloating about a victory, as long as I was unprovoked. Shit-talking rights are real and they can be earned. But they also do have an expiration date on them where you have to let them go when unprovoked. Otherwise, it does reach a point where its either just delusion or trolling, and therefore, can be safely ignored from then on.

But okay, even if we say that was a tournament or grudge match, you still only have 1 match win over me. I have about 5 or 6 tournament match or grudge match victories over you. You are proud of that record I guess? Okay, cool. You always did have a funny way of focusing only on your wins and ignoring all of your losses, I suppose. I'm just glad I don't have to rest the glory of my entire myth career on 1 match I was lucky to win. I am taking how much meaning you pin on that match as a compliment of me more than anything else.

That is the difference between you and me. I don't care about my many wins over you that much. I don't even really like talking about them. I only mention them when I absolutely have to to keep your (or others) delusions in perspective. By contrast, you hang your entire myth identity on your 1 and only notable match win over a top 1v1 player in a tiny event from 8 years ago, and continue to look for every opportunity to bring it up again as is clearly seen here by your butting into this random thread that had nothing to do with you, and never even mentioned you.

You also never answered if you played in the 2008 Lethal 1v1 tournament (hosted by Paris). I was not there as I was either still deployed in Iraq or just recently came back and was preparing to leave the military. But I know Kirk won it (and apparently Raziel or Rabican took 2nd place). Did you play in it? And if so, what happened?

I also find it hard to believe that you did not participate in the 2009 1v1 tournament that I went to the finals against Tirri, or the 2010 Sunset 1v1 tournament that I went to the finals against Ghengis (and also beat Tirri again earlier). Did you play in either of those tournaments? If you did, it is likely you lost to Tirri and/or me (and possibly even Ghengis). If not, I just find it very odd you were very active during these years and somehow never entered any of the major 1v1 tournaments during this time. Come to think of it, although I have long known that you never won an actual 1v1 tournament, it seems that you may not have even ever made it to an actual 1v1 tournament finals match before either, which is kind of a sad resume for a top 1v1 player that has been playing as long as you have.

adrenaline wrote:And since when is being the top player on the winning team in several consecutive tournaments NOT a credential for 5 ballerdom? That hardly even makes sense.


Jesus christ. For the 10th time, take it up with the rest of the myth community that rated you 4.3 balls for this year's mwc. I never even participated in that stupid community rating. WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH ABOUT HOW I RATE YOU? WHY ARE YOU STILL ARGUING WITH ME ABOUT THIS? Do you not realize what an incredibly small and insecure child this makes you out to be? Grow up already. Learn from me and learn to IGNORE IT if you disagree. WHO CARES. For god sakes, in mwc2011 I was rated something absurd like 3.5 balls by the community, and I had exactly 0 fucks given about it the entire tournament. I never mentioned it once as I proceeded to captain the winning team in the most dominant mwc performance in the history of myth. Try to do less whining about rating, and more winning. Or apparently, you seem to care more about perception than reality.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby wwo » 29 Jul 2018, 13:45

(half-assed guesses at numbers)

Adren words: 700
Gkg words: 2000
Total times some variant of "i don't care": 48
People who read this thread and care: <2 probably

(did i interject too soon? I sensed boredom encroaching from both participants)

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby par73 » 29 Jul 2018, 16:33

Giant Killer General wrote:Apparently, I was on some level trying to sabotage myself because I was so frustrated with people still dodging me, and I wanted it to be over.

I've been there one too many times !

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 29 Jul 2018, 19:12

Giant Killer General wrote:Me joining a game and challenging you, was actually just a result of you saying earlier that you would play me eventually (your link even shows you replying "sign me up" soon after I announced it). However, you kept on delaying, apparently waiting for some "perfect moment" to finally play me. I had to pull your teeth for a solid week or two before you finally relented to play.


I was literally the 2nd person to play you. I did not delay anything... accepted the challenge as soon as you presented it.

Giant Killer General wrote:You also never answered if you played in the 2008 Lethal 1v1 tournament (hosted by Paris). I was not there as I was either still deployed in Iraq or just recently came back and was preparing to leave the military. But I know Kirk won it (and apparently Raziel or Rabican took 2nd place). Did you play in it? And if so, what happened?
...
I also find it hard to believe that you did not participate in the 2009 1v1 tournament that I went to the finals against Tirri, or the 2010 Sunset 1v1 tournament that I went to the finals against Ghengis (and also beat Tirri again earlier). Did you play in either of those tournaments?


I played in one of those... not sure which one... lost to Ducky in hilarious fashion fairly late in the tourney in a series of weird games (like Caer light stampede, something assassin.. bunch of big maps with weird gametypes) at like 4 am when I was fucked outta my mind. Truly a hilarious match that I should have waited til the next day to play hah. Not sure if I played in the other ones... but it seems likely. I have beaten ghengis in a 1v1 tourney, so I guess that wasn't sunset if he was a finalist. Beat raz and rab in a 1v1 tourney, so that must not have been Lethal... can't remember which is which anymore without websites existing. All I really recall is the later one where I made it deep and the tourneys never finished... seems a trend with 1v1 tourneys post-2010.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 29 Jul 2018, 21:56

You "accepted" the challenge, not disputing that. You just didn't actually play until a week or 2 later after accepting, and after at least 1 or 2 prior attempts for me to get you to play. Yes, only 2 or 3 people ever played me (Absolut was the other, and I think also Paris, so props to them). Hence my frustration with the community response for a chance at free money for playing a game.

It's probably pretty likely that you played in all of those 1v1 tournaments since you were very active during that time between 2008 and 2011. Which also means that it is likely that you lost in all of them before even making it to the finals. It's funny how you can't remember who else you lost to besides Ducky. Even I remember my loss to Rabican in 2006. And I would remember more of them if there were actually more of them. Your mind has a funny way of playing tricks on you. Maybe if you could remember more of your losses, you would be more humbled by them.

This is another reason why our little match that you won could never be considered the same as a true "tournament" for the purposes of objective analysis. You didn't have to beat multiple people. And it was incredibly challenging for you to even get to the finals in a tournament, which you apparently never accomplished before (although I'll grant you that it is likely you would have years later in the MFC 2013 tournament since Tirri was removed from the tournament, if it actually had brackets). Not a tournament win, but still a good match win. Doesn't really matter anymore though since you could never repeat it in the last decade and I've avenged the loss multiple times by beating you 4 times on the record since then. This is why I never understood why you still cling to it. Well, we know why now, I suppose. That was your best match win, and only win over a top 1v1er ever apparently.

Shaister is in a somewhat similar boat. Although when I played him, he felt just as tough as Kirk or Tirri. But he always choked hard in tournaments (losing to the likes of nemesis, browning, and others). I don't think he ever won a 1v1 tournament in myth 2 (not tfl), let alone even made it to the finals either. He deserves a mention though, I suppose.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 29 Jul 2018, 23:59

My memory of these things sucks because I've been a degenerate pothead since I started playing myth, and was in university between 2002 and 2009 and partied pretty hard the entire time. I'd wager that 95% of the games I've ever played I've been fucked up in one way or another... so I'm lucky to remember any games the next day, nevermind years later. Even now I only play myth high... just can't do it sober.

I only remember that loss to Ducky because it was a hilarious match. I seriously can't think of anyone else from that era that I have lost a match to, other than yourself and Kirk that one time in MFC... which leads me to think that maybe I didn't play in them.

As for whoever hosted that tourney in 2011... I have no idea. I assumed it was you... maybe Paris? Can't think of anyone else that has hosted anything other than maybe Toxyn and Grim. Many... somebody really should have archived all the tourney sites... or at least info. So much has been lost.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 30 Jul 2018, 00:18

adrenaline wrote:Krik.. lol i totally missed that burn by Jah... not bad. Hogan vs $plinter LOL... 2007? 10-1 is HIGHLY doubtful... and without context... he could have been talking about anything. Also, Raid? That's how I know this is a joke... I do not play raid and have certainly never willingly played it 1v1. Quite possible it wasn't even me, because we both had all of the RoT account passwords. How do you even have films from back then still? I've lost my film collection like 10x over. Do you have the films from our "retirement" match in 09/10 whenever it was? 3-0 for me... in front of a full game of spectators and you dropped in the last game LOL. Shocking, I know.

GKG, I've only played Tirri once in tourney... ya it was 2-2, we didn't finish the match. I've played him several games casually though... always great games and quite fun, because Tirri plays with style and isn't predictable (he also isn't a bitch, win or lose).
And since when is being the top player on the winning team in several consecutive tournaments NOT a credential for 5 ballerdom? That hardly even makes sense.

And since you keep saying the $100 match wasn't a tournament:
http://mwc10.forumchitchat.com/post/everyoneisinthefinals1vs1tournament-4757525?&trail=20

That should end that argument, I'd think. And you came into a game and challenged ME... so this whole 4 hrs of sleep bullshit is just that... if it was a problem for you, you wouldn't have laid down the challenge.


It was you for the following reasons:

1. Neither of us had our *RoT* tags on, therefore we did not create those until after we figured out who each other was.
2. You were being a dick to Monty and talking shit to me and him for teaming in a few FFA games leading up to that 1v1 series. I offered to 1v1 you and you gladly accepted because you knew that I didn't know your true identity anyway.
3. We were just going through the regular Myth multiplayer maps, and we finished up on that Raid game.

I can remember all the numbers to all 7 of my credit cards dude, I don't fucking forget anything. This presumed "3-0" retirement match? Do you know how many people try to impersonate me over the years? It isn't hard, I have a pretty easy personality to mimic, but fortunately my playing style isn't. I can assure you I've never lost to you in back to back games, let alone a series. For probably 50-60 times we have played 1v1, I'd be shocked if you won more than 7-8 of them. That's how lopsided this series is adren, but since you smoke the reefer, your memory isn't all there, and you admit this.

As far as me having films from 2007... the only reason I don't have them from 2001 is because my original computer crashed and took some seriously amazing films with it. I still agonize over that shit until this day.

Tata

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 30 Jul 2018, 00:27

Giant Killer General wrote:This was one of the main reasons I respected Chohan so much. He was a true champion in this regard by fearlessly playing everyone in the biggest tournament, prize, retirement, or grudge matches. He is the only other player I have seen that exhibited this type of fearless attitude outside of myself. Everyone else I have seen (you, Kirk, Tirri, and nearly everyone else) has been scared to 1v1 me or each other at various times.

You also never answered if you played in the 2008 Lethal 1v1 tournament (hosted by Paris). I was not there as I was either still deployed in Iraq or just recently came back and was preparing to leave the military. But I know Kirk won it (and apparently Raziel or Rabican took 2nd place). Did you play in it? And if so, what happened?



Chohan was good, but was a one-hit wonder when it came to overall Myth. He wasn't that great in teams, and had zero interest in Coop. I would add to that list Erik, who got shunned from the Myth society despite his raucous disregard for anything ego-related. He retired BTT, and then got retired by Chohan to unretire his brother. Back in the day, and leading up to roughly 2011, I played everyone at any time in 1v1. I haven't played competitively nor played a single tournament since then, and really haven't cared about anything other than having fun and attributing to helping develop plugins with the developers. My shit talk game hasn't lost a step, and I know it causes you more damage that I pick and choose when to beat you at 1v1 without giving you at least a chance of beating me back. I know you can beat me at times, but not the majority of times as our films and screenshots in this thread have indicated. If you really think that "retirement series" you posted was legit, then we have "proof" that our series is 17-5 in my favor.

Also to answer the 1v1 Lethal tourney, that was definitely the height of Myth skill at the time. You were deployed as I remember, and Rabican came in 2nd. Raz lost 5-2 to me but for some reason kept saying we still had to finish? Guy was a schizo so who knows.

For the record, I've NEVER EVER been beaten in a 1v1 TROW game dating back all the way to 2003. Never. Once.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 00:54

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:This presumed "3-0" retirement match? Do you know how many people try to impersonate me over the years? It isn't hard, I have a pretty easy personality to mimic, but fortunately my playing style isn't.


We had actual logins back then... it 100% was you, whether you think so or not. You've also shown yourself to be a pathological liar and sociopath in general over the years... sooo there's that, too.

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I can assure you I've never lost to you in back to back games, let alone a series. For probably 50-60 times we have played 1v1, I'd be shocked if you won more than 7-8 of them.


Holy fuck HAHAHAHAHAHA ok... you are delusional. Maybe if you don't count dropping before the game ends as a loss... then sure, maybe ;) I guess I'll take GKG's side in your argument, since he, at least, is reasonably sane.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby par73 » 30 Jul 2018, 01:29

I think I hosted Sunset, I don't recall 2011 1v1 tourney; are we sure they are not the same thing ? :P Did Sunset Finish? I'd bet I hosted 2011 and it didn't finish ;)

I'm not sure I played in either 1v1 tournament for money between Cho and GKG hosting public contests, I recall Abs then straight to Adren; I only played MFC QRs aggressively of 2010s GKG 1v1 tournaments I recall. Honestly without the melee tournament in 2005, I wouldn't have able to grow as a player. Less players participated in that than the 1v1 tournament in 2005, I recall adren in both as well as placing higher than him in both !! :twisted: I think me and nem got 2nd in melee/1v1 that year. The point about the community afraid to play for the money is actually pretty funny, as in both events the players who ended up performing the best were former teammates of that player between Adren, Magne, BTT.

Cho/BTT/Erik story had some nostalgic drama leading to legacy, by the time I got to 1v1 BTT I was able to beat him 3-2 on his host. Some ggs, but I doubt he was really trying at all against a random newcomer.

If the top 1v1ers still have it in them to set aside time for grueling 1v1 match I'd love to broadcast it similar to the way Shaitan covered Flatline vs Verminix a few years back... Even then, what stops us from another 1v1 tournament now ? :D

I'll email Liger... :lol:

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 30 Jul 2018, 02:41

I think TB hosted sunset. You hosted Lethal in 2008, par. At least according to some website that has some tourney info on it. Absolut hosted the other 1v1 tourney in 2010 I think, which I beat Ghengis in the finals. Not sure who hosted the other one that didn't finish.

I guess you are right par, you didn't play me for my money either. I didn't remember you playing in that either, I only remember Absolut and Adren. The only reason I mentioned you was because for some reason in that mwc10 link that adren posted, I said in it that I beat you with some match score reported. I'm not sure what that was all about. So yea, I only got 2 matches after 2 weeks at least, which was absolutely absurd to me. I was so frustrated by the low turnout. I had a lot of "promises" to play me from people, but nobody actually would follow through on it. I really do think most people care far more about their ego and pride by avoiding the risk of losing, than they do about the chance at winning money.

This is also why I always laughed at people's suggestions that just adding prize money would fix everything in myth and make things competitive again (like Cu's suggestion for a "real money" match of sorts years ago, somewhere around 2013-2015) and never even bothered talking or thinking about such suggestions. I knew better from my earlier experience with this. It would have to be some ridiculous sum of money that nobody would ever donate to reach a point of even generating a little bit of interest.

Yes, the Death Before Dishonor 1v1 tournament I hosted (I think 2005?) would be another possible adren loss as well if you remember him playing in it. I do not recall how he did there at all.

Chohan was no 1-hit wonder. He has way more recorded matches with players than you did Kirk. If anything, you were far more of a 1-hit wonder than him, because as you say, you only won 1 1v1 tournament and then stopped competing. And regardless, from what little I remember or knew of him, the guy did actually fight anyone fearlessly, which is more than nearly anyone else can say. Perhaps you most of all, Kirk.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 30 Jul 2018, 02:44

adrenaline wrote:
BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:This presumed "3-0" retirement match? Do you know how many people try to impersonate me over the years? It isn't hard, I have a pretty easy personality to mimic, but fortunately my playing style isn't.


We had actual logins back then... it 100% was you, whether you think so or not. You've also shown yourself to be a pathological liar and sociopath in general over the years... sooo there's that, too.

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I can assure you I've never lost to you in back to back games, let alone a series. For probably 50-60 times we have played 1v1, I'd be shocked if you won more than 7-8 of them.


Holy fuck HAHAHAHAHAHA ok... you are delusional. Maybe if you don't count dropping before the game ends as a loss... then sure, maybe ;) I guess I'll take GKG's side in your argument, since he, at least, is reasonably sane.


I literally just posted numerous screenshots of you yelling excuses and dropping out of a game you were losing a 1v1 in. You just admitted you can't remember shit, and you are displaying just that. I have no reason to lie about anything Myth related. Have I lied about my real life before? Yes. It's all part of the act. I win again.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 30 Jul 2018, 02:57

Giant Killer General wrote:Chohan was no 1-hit wonder. He has way more recorded matches with players than you did Kirk. If anything, you were far more of a 1-hit wonder than him, because as you say, you only won 1 1v1 tournament and then stopped competing. And regardless, from what little I remember or knew of him, the guy did actually fight anyone fearlessly, which is more than nearly anyone else can say.


I never saw him do anything great. I beat him in every 1v1 we played against each other, albeit none of them were during tournaments, because that's when I was banned from the server from 2003-2006. That's when Chohan was most active and I could never consistently stay unbanned from the server. I would have won MWC 2003 on 5H17L1ST with Erik if I hadn't been IP banned on my dial up internet at the time. Ghetto cakes was my 2004 MWC team and we were stacked well too, but got banned before games started. I focused on Urban Recon during those years and became the best at that, absolutely dominating everyone even 3v1 unit at a time. I was miles better than anyone else playing that, even a bigger gap than I am at regular Myth.

Chohan was a one hit wonder because he only played regular Myth. He was good, but still not the absolute best.

I've been consistently the best at anything related to Myth:

1. Regular Myth multi/Coop/1v1
2. Raid (since this is basically a cult map with its own categorizing)
3. WW2 (particularly Urban Recon) I was 6 month Comet on Playmyth for Urban Recon alone
4. Civil War - I won several tournaments back when it was popular
5. Myth Done Quick - I hold the record for fastest times completing every single M2 Solo campaign levels
6. First player to beat Gladiators Depredation (Glad 5) on Legendary Solo
7. First player to beat Valley of Despair and only person to beat it in under 3 hours
8. 4 MWC Rings, 1v1 tournament champion, FFA champion... I've done it all

The only thing I admittedly suck at because I think it sucks anyway? Fetchball. Its a cool map, but it doesn't interest me at all and therefore never cared to learn it.


GKG other than boring mazz that takes little to sometimes slightly moderate skill and regular Myth, what all have you done? Can you stand here and tell me that your Myth Resume can even compare to what I have mentioned above? Nobody cares about Mazz. If you truly had decent players playing Mazz, it would be a win every single game because its so fucking painstakingly easy. Its so god damn slow paced and boring that I have literally fallen asleep playing it before.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 03:22

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I literally just posted numerous screenshots of you yelling excuses and dropping out of a game you were losing a 1v1 in.
...
I have no reason to lie about anything Myth related.


Are you referring to the SINGLE screenshot from 2007 you just posted of me SAYING NOTHING and NOT DROPPING on Raid? So you have no reason to lie about anything Myth related... you just choose to anyways. So glad we cleared that up.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 30 Jul 2018, 03:35

Oh poor Kirkie. Come back to reality. First of all, you were a relatively unknown player until maybe around 2007, which is about the same time Chohan stopped playing right after his 7 penis rising victory in August, 2007 (and mwc06 was the last mwc he played in). You were never even close to the player Chohan was during most of his reign. It's quite plausible that you never even actually 1v1d Chohan. I was part of the competitive 1v1 scene 3-4 years before you were, and I only 1v1'd Chohan twice that I can remember (although part of this has to do with the timing of my joining the military in 2004). If you did play him, you definitely were not beating him as you had years of opportunity to enter major 1v1 matches against him and were nowhere to be found. I am not sure if anyone can even independently confirm how early you started playing myth, particularly if you were even around during the bungie.net years. Of course, you will claim a lot of things, but its all an act, so any reasonable person has to look for independent confirmation of anything you say before considering it actually true.

I am perhaps one of the few people still around that knew you before you actually got good and knows who you really were before you started trying to pretend to be something else. You were a 3 ball player in your early years, with a shy, quiet, and even timid personality - totally different than the false bravado you started acting with years later and still do to this day. Once you got good, it apparently transformed your ego as you have pretended to be someone else ever since. Or maybe that was just your way of coming out of your shell since you were so young back then and probably just learning how to socialize with people.

Chohan was among the best. Debating THE best is a pointless conversation.

I'm happy for you with how proud you are of your various co-op accomplishments. How anyone weighs these things is purely subjective, though. And yes, when I or many others discuss great myth players, I think we are nearly always referring to regular myth only. It's certainly fine to consider co-op or non-regular myth 3rd party plugins too, but I think it's normal to think of them as completely different games. There's no sense in trying to compare them. If you did though, it would be pretty important to consider the number of players and the amount of time those players spent trying to accomplish the same thing before deciding how important that accomplishment was relative to others' accomplishments.

I really don't care how anyone evaluates me. I have by far the most mwc victories (while also leading the teams of nearly all of them), and one of the most, if not the most, 1v1 tournament victories. All the spin, trolling, or bias in the world can never objectively take those very simple facts from me. Not to mention, I also retired you. So I am good with all of that regardless of what anyone else says. I am very secure with myself. When you have won as much as I have over as long of a period of time as I have, I don't feel very much of a need to initiate a discussion about my accomplishments anymore. People can think what they will. At the end of the day, everyone else thinks way more about me than I could possibly ever think about any particular one of them.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 05:15

You and Par definitely did play in the money match... don't think Abs played, however. And I didn't play the dbd 1v1 in 2005... didn't play MWC in 2005 either... was away for several months with no internet.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 30 Jul 2018, 05:30

Absolut definitely played me in my money match. In any case, 2 or 3 matches, makes little difference.

I don't have any memory of you in DBD, but it was actually in late 2006, not 2005. I am not sure how confident Paris' memory is of that tournament, but my memory of it is poor as well, other than me winning it. I am also not sure if you played in Shai's 7 penis rising 1v1 tournament in 2007. But if you did, I am pretty sure you did not place in the top 10. The other 4 later tournaments from 2008 to 2011 is a different story, though. I am pretty sure you did play in most, if not all of those.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 05:57

I think I did play in 7pr, but not dbd. I think Nem eliminated me... vaguely have a memory of that. I was no where near my peak 1v1 form at that time... until I started playing countless duels vs Shai and Raz and got much much better.

Wth guys

Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Wth guys » 30 Jul 2018, 07:52

Man just fuck this, each of you play each other Jesus christ, this whole circle jerk over a fucking game as if none of you had anything huge accomplisments in real life, and none of you could let go of your fucking egos either as if you had to overcompensate for something you lack irl.

If you can't fucking change, at least try to settle this your way which is not whatever you currently do on this forum, fucking play each other, prove each other wrong let's see who is the best.

Also while I agree that none of you are 5 ballers - not even you GKG - (imo Kirk is the closest to that) you shouldn't take this current TA seriously as it is filled with major flaws, either the community cannot measure skill eg doesn't know what avarage is on a scale of 5 or just havent paid attention to the game in years.

Whatever the case just stop fucking whining here and play each other, you make sick, it was fun at the start but now It's fucking boring.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 30 Jul 2018, 08:47

Ooo, hey guys, looks like we did get someone mad after all, and without even trying. It was just none of us, ha.

Big man can talk tough behind his anonymous account, lol.

Hey dude, calm down. It's a free internet. Don't like it, don't read it. Nothing major has happened on these forums in like a year, and the first moment some people start a conversation it's all like I WILL NOT HAVE IT WITH PEOPLE CONVERSING WITHOUT ME, SHUT THIS SHIT DOWN IMMEDIATELY.

I AM GOING TO WHINE AT YOU ABOUT WHINING. I AM GOING TO RATE YOU BUT ALL RATINGS ARE BULLSHIT.

just lol. Go be a man and get on your real account if you want some attention, honey.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 09:02

uh oh we upset an anonymous keyboard warrior. better stop arguing before we unsettle the other 3 forum users.

It's probably Kirk LOL

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby tirri » 30 Jul 2018, 10:33

Giant Killer General wrote:This was one of the main reasons I respected Chohan so much. He was a true champion in this regard by fearlessly playing everyone in the biggest tournament, prize, retirement, or grudge matches. He is the only other player I have seen that exhibited this type of fearless attitude outside of myself. Everyone else I have seen (you, Kirk, Tirri, and nearly everyone else) has been scared to 1v1 me or each other at various times.


This is pretty much only connected to activity and nothing else. When I was playing 1v1s like crazy before 2004, I was on 2 separate 1v1 ladders with over 100 matches total, seeking people out night and day to get matches in and had a ridiculously good record. The first 1v1 tournament I won I completely dominated, losing 2 games the whole tourney (talking about records, I DARE SAY THIS IS ONE). When Chohan started 1v1ing people and make a name for himself, I literally sought him out, challenged him and beat him soundly and did it again after Chohan wanted another chance.

After the army in 2004 I lost my myth computer and had to play on win XP where every time I tried to use presets fast, there was about a 50-50 chance the preset wouldn't select. This hindered my play for years since I'm completely reliant on presets and the problem was by far the worst in duels so I pretty much stopped playing them alltogether and I also didn't feel like playing myth much either.

I haven't been "scared" to play anyone after that either. I have had zero reason to seek out players 10x more active than me when I haven't really felt like playing myth and have felt completely clumsy in duels due to the preset problem. There were a few 1v1 tourneys along the years that managed to get me interested and play some 1v1s for a few weeks and I dare say compared to my activity level, I have always done just fine.


For everyone super interested, the preset problem has been gone for some years (about 5 I think) since I bought a mechanical keyboard. However by then a lot of other things have caused my inactivity.
Also does anyone remember the name for the ladder thingy of early 2000s? It used to host ladders for several games, had groovy flaming icons if you got on a winning streak etc? I wouldn't mind searching that site's archives

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 30 Jul 2018, 21:40

tirri wrote:where every time I tried to use presets fast, there was about a 50-50 chance the preset wouldn't select.


I've had this issue on and off for years, even with a mechanical keyboard. Think it may be a latency issue on other hosts... like we're clicking too fast for the lag or something. It's quite frustrating. I've had to force myself to toggle between presets slower to compensate.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 31 Jul 2018, 01:34

That is a pretty convenient narrative for you Tirri, without anything really backing it up except your own version of events.

Here is another narrative for people to consider, backed up by some actual evidence.

In mwc06, the first of 2 mwc's you ever won, here are your TA's (taken from this page: http://www.mythgaming.net/mwc2006/player.php?id=87

Threat Assessment - Grim
"Tirri is probably one of the worst players of all time, but somehow he still has managed to win more tournaments than anyone else. He has been active and is definately one of the most dangerous players in this tournament.

His music taste sucks though."

Threat Assessment - Dantski
"Tirri is the best active player around. 2nd best when Chohan is playing.

He'll tell us all about his tourney wins on the forum later."


Threat Assessment - tiger
"Tirri (also known as Drizzt) has been the best player at Myth since the dawn of the 21st century - and he was very, very good before. It startles me how he manages to get such incredible ratios with any set of units against any team - he always seems to emerge from every battle with gaudy success. He's pretty much a six-ball player, though I can't give him anything more than a five."

--

By comparison, here are Chohan's TA's by the same 3 TA'ers (taken from this page: http://www.mythgaming.net/mwc2006/player.php?id=174

Threat Assessment - Grim
"Chohan is the type of player that can own you upside down without even breaking sweat. He is most likely the most dangerous player you will be face in this tournament. He has won both of the 1vs1 tournaments organized in the last three years and if you add the two Bme tournament victories to that, his streak is pretty impressive. Only few players will be able to give him any real resistance. You better hope that you have players like that in your team."

Threat Assessment - Dantski
"Chohan has been the best myth player for the last few years, I doubt anyone can stand against his flank if he's on the ball.

The hvi hittur of a team thats won all its previous tournies."


Threat Assessment - tiger
"I have never seen Chohan lose a 1v1. Quick anecdote: after BTT lost a 1v1 "retirement match" to Erik in 2004, Chohan rose to his brother's defense and deftly handed Erik his ass and BTT his spot on pm.net. That series was the best 1v1 match I've ever seen in my entire life.

He's the best player in the world."


--

So you were fully active at this time according to grim, and according to Dantski, Chohan is #1, you are #2. According to grim, Chohan is #1, and you are just "one of the best". And according to Tiger, you and Chohan are both the best simultaneously apparently, but he further says that he never saw Chohan lose a 1v1.

Those TAs were also given at the start of mwc (maybe even before mwc began), which was before Chohan's 1v1 tournament just mere months later. Which means some prominent members of the myth community were already acknowledging Chohan clearly above you, even before he went undefeated in his 1v1 tournament months later. And in that 1v1 tournament, you either A: didn't participate in despite being fully active during this mwc (and beating Chohan previously, according to you only), and with prize money being offered too - which could only further mean that you were scared. Or B: you did play him, but you lost to him. I know Shaister played Chohan at this time and lost to him badly, but I can't recall what you did. Which one was it?

Furthermore, this wide perception of Chohan being better than you is easily explained by what Grim states in his TA that Chohan has won both of the 1v1 tournaments in the last 3 years (so roughly from 2003-2006). But this was during your PRIME activity years. Where were you in these, and what happened?

And then there was mwc07, your 2nd and last mwc win, another prime opportunity to prove your chops against Chohan in Shaister's 7 penis rising tournament. I mean, he went undefeated in his 1v1 tournament a year prior, but you say you beat him twice previously (again, according to you only), and what did you do? Again, you either, A: didn't play (which can only mean scared again as you still played and won in mwc that year). Or B: you did play, and lost to somebody because I know you were not in the top 3. Which one was it?

This only matches my several experiences with you in later 1v1 tournaments. As Adren and I already alluded, you dodged me from a 1v1 match in another 1v1 tournament for several weeks despite registering and participating in the 1v1 tournament up to that point, which caused the tournament to be cancelled. Pretty convenient timing there. And you have pulled similar antics in other tournaments with me as well, even though you participate just fine in matches against other lesser players, and in the mwc matches that often were happening at the same time. Scheduling has never been pleasant with you, and I know for a fact you were adamantly practicing duels right before our 1v1 finals match in the 2009 tournament (right before the mwc finals), which is part of the reason why.

I don't dispute that you are less active in these years, but I could easily completely abandon this game for a year or more, come back, and still fully expect to handily beat the entire community of myth in 1v1s, except for just a few people. You are apparently proud of yourself for doing only that, with more than nothing activity during several mwc seasons and simultaneous 1v1 tournaments that you participated in.

The truth is, you lack confidence in your abilities against the best players unless you have pristine activity levels and perfect practice because you don't want to risk losses, even though the benefit of such activity and practice is marginal at best for a veteran top player. You haven't had pristine activity levels and perfect practice since 2006. But of course, there are no recorded wins of you over Chohan from 2003-2006 despite at least 3 prime opportunities to do so. As we all know, you care a LOT about your tourney wins. But this also means you care a lot about your tournament losses too, which is what makes you a scared player.

But okay, let's say your prime was earlier than Chohan's long undefeated streak in 2000-2003. Unfortunately, I hate to break it to you, but most of myth was playing on dial-up internet connections during this period of time (especially Americans, who tend to lag behind the rest of the developed world). This can hardly be considered the primo era of skill in myth, even if it did have more active players. 500ms pings were typical back then. About 350ms was considered the absolute best ping possible for a player with a typical dial-up internet connection speed when connected to the absolute best, top-tier broadband hosts. By today's standards, anything over 200ms (nearly half of that) starts to noticeably affect play negatively for a top player. Anyone that had broadband internet (even DSL) would have had a MASSIVE advantage over the rest the community. When I was on dial-up internet back then, I was a 3 ball player. A few brief times I got my hands on DSL, I was instantly a 4 ball player just from the lower pings. That's how big of a difference internet connection speed was back then.

Most of America was still on America Online back then, or some other dial-up internet provider (56k dial-up modems, with more like 14.4k-28.8k actual connection speeds). Finland happens to be a country with one of the earliest and highest adoption rates of broadband internet. You really think there was never a time period around then that Finnish players were not enjoying a significant advantage over nearly everyone else due to much better internet connection speeds? Or tell us, when did you get broadband internet? By comparison, I got DSL for the first time in 2005, and cable internet for the first time in 2008. This is fairly typical for an American player.

TLDR: Chohan went undefeated in at least 4 1v1 tournaments from roughly 2003 to August, 2007. You did nothing to stop him during this entire time, despite it being mostly during your prime activity years. Either you lost and are scared now to admit the losses while trying to claim earlier wins over him, or you never played him because you were scared. Either way, you were scared of him. And in the same way, you were scared of me in later years too.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 31 Jul 2018, 01:42

adrenaline wrote:
BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I literally just posted numerous screenshots of you yelling excuses and dropping out of a game you were losing a 1v1 in.
...
I have no reason to lie about anything Myth related.


Are you referring to the SINGLE screenshot from 2007 you just posted of me SAYING NOTHING and NOT DROPPING on Raid? So you have no reason to lie about anything Myth related... you just choose to anyways. So glad we cleared that up.


Literally just posted 15 screenshots above in a post. You have to click on the link to view the album.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 31 Jul 2018, 01:58

Giant Killer General wrote:Oh poor Kirkie. Come back to reality. First of all, you were a relatively unknown player until maybe around 2007, which is about the same time Chohan stopped playing right after his 7 penis rising victory in August, 2007 (and mwc06 was the last mwc he played in). You were never even close to the player Chohan was during most of his reign. It's quite plausible that you never even actually 1v1d Chohan. I was part of the competitive 1v1 scene 3-4 years before you were, and I only 1v1'd Chohan twice that I can remember (although part of this has to do with the timing of my joining the military in 2004). If you did play him, you definitely were not beating him as you had years of opportunity to enter major 1v1 matches against him and were nowhere to be found. I am not sure if anyone can even independently confirm how early you started playing myth, particularly if you were even around during the bungie.net years. Of course, you will claim a lot of things, but its all an act, so any reasonable person has to look for independent confirmation of anything you say before considering it actually true.

I am perhaps one of the few people still around that knew you before you actually got good and knows who you really were before you started trying to pretend to be something else. You were a 3 ball player in your early years, with a shy, quiet, and even timid personality - totally different than the false bravado you started acting with years later and still do to this day. Once you got good, it apparently transformed your ego as you have pretended to be someone else ever since. Or maybe that was just your way of coming out of your shell since you were so young back then and probably just learning how to socialize with people.

Chohan was among the best. Debating THE best is a pointless conversation.

I'm happy for you with how proud you are of your various co-op accomplishments. How anyone weighs these things is purely subjective, though. And yes, when I or many others discuss great myth players, I think we are nearly always referring to regular myth only. It's certainly fine to consider co-op or non-regular myth 3rd party plugins too, but I think it's normal to think of them as completely different games. There's no sense in trying to compare them. If you did though, it would be pretty important to consider the number of players and the amount of time those players spent trying to accomplish the same thing before deciding how important that accomplishment was relative to others' accomplishments.

I really don't care how anyone evaluates me. I have by far the most mwc victories (while also leading the teams of nearly all of them), and one of the most, if not the most, 1v1 tournament victories. All the spin, trolling, or bias in the world can never objectively take those very simple facts from me. Not to mention, I also retired you. So I am good with all of that regardless of what anyone else says. I am very secure with myself. When you have won as much as I have over as long of a period of time as I have, I don't feel very much of a need to initiate a discussion about my accomplishments anymore. People can think what they will. At the end of the day, everyone else thinks way more about me than I could possibly ever think about any particular one of them.



Great my post deleted so I'm typing this again. Didn't read all of your post because I don't care.

I have been kicking ass ever since I have been playing this game, except I was versed across all the plugins from early on. I was never the absolute dominator I was in later years at regular Myth until people stopped playing 3rd party as much. I won Civil War tournaments before you ever won a single thing. I won Urban Recon tournaments and was 100% untouchable at it, beating the best that ever played it. I also won the only ever Raid tournament, and also invented the giant trap with split melee. Make no mistake about it, I've always been good.

The guy who got me involved with Myth was a real life best friend, whose teams I leeched to 2 early MWC victories. I played small roles under the guise of someone else's account instead of using my own so as to not get caught dummying. I did not win MVP. I only played 1 game in the finals. I played less than half the overall games in each of those tournaments. I was fucking 12 or 13 years old, and we all know you literally have to be an adult to fully understand how to play Myth because it is such a brain exercise.

I remember in 2003 when I had developed my own ego and personality by then, and some quiet, unknown player latched onto me and started holding my dick for me while I shit talked my way to victory after victory. I go in and out of Myth over the next 3 years mostly due to being IP banned on a dial up connection, and when I come back seriously in 2007, turns out that little guy developed quite an ego of his own, following in my footsteps. Hey Paris, sup champ? Paris is one of the game's greatest players, having played in and hosted just about every tournament since his MWC victories with TCOX.

Remember GeneralX? I hated that little fucker with a passion. But he loved sucking my dick and he ended up being a decent player for the time he was online. I am influential. My style works. My style wins. Just because you don't remember me or the aliases I played under all those years, doesn't mean I wasn't any good until you knew who I was.

I had never heard a thing about adrenaline until 2007. I came back and this guy has an ego and talks shit all the time. I literally thought he was some dummy account or an overzealous newb because I'd never seen him a second before that year. Shaister vouches he'd been around since the TFL days, and I believe Shai because he's always been a straight shooter with me.

Don't forget I put NC on the map with their first ever team tournament victory.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby BIG KROK V8 SS » 31 Jul 2018, 02:03

adrenaline wrote:It's probably Kirk LOL



I knew you would say that. Fortunately for you I don't even know how to create an anonymous account on these forums. I don't know how to computer. Also, I would never say I "WASN'T a 5 baller." Technically, I'm the game's only 8 baller. GKG is a 6 baller because he is better than your typical 5 baller. 5 Ballers consist of Tirri, Paris, Nemesis, Zer, Rabican. Adren, you show flashes of 5 baller skill, but ultimately your soft style passive play must be considered, therefore you are a 4 baller. Seriously dude, most of those screenshots of the films I posted, you were getting your shit pushed in so far it started coming out of your own fucking mouth.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 31 Jul 2018, 02:36

There is only one thing we can know for sure is absolutely not true in what you just stated, which is this:

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I leeched to 2 early MWC victories.


Nobody claims to win 2 early mwcs victories without giving the specific years they won and other details, unless you are just straight up trying to lie about it. The championship teams of the early mwcs, and their entire rosters of players are very well known. You definitely were not in there. And furthermore, you were way too young for this to even be plausible. I was among the youngest people to be playing back in 1998-2001, and you are younger than me. Pretty much everyone that was playing back then was older than me. So I am fairly certain you never even started playing Myth until after the Bungie.net era.

And since you are trying to lie about this, we can safely assume the rest is most likely lies too, just as always.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby tirri » 31 Jul 2018, 05:46

Giant Killer General wrote:That is a pretty convenient narrative for you Tirri, without anything really backing it up except your own version of events.


you pointedly ignored most of what i said in my post and imply my word isn't trustworthy. Then write paragraphs of text with questions thrown in between that I should try to counter. Well since I don't have films from those times, I'm not going to start interviewing contemporaries or start scouring through old pages to find anecdotal evidence, I'm afraid there's very little I can say that you can't just rebuke with "LOL I guess we will just have to take your word for it". A lot of what you casually infer or throw out there is laughable with literally no evidence to back it up while saying my word isn't good enough.


Giant Killer General wrote:By today's standards, anything over 200ms (nearly half of that) starts to noticeably affect play negatively for a top player.


Incidentally, at least in the past decade I don't think I have ever played a tournament 1v1 match against an American on anything else than on an American host. I certainly haven't played you on an euro host have I? My ping on the american hosts that host nowadays hovers around 250- 300 which I hear noticeably affects my play.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 31 Jul 2018, 07:19

Good grief, look at how many excuses you have. If you don't have perfect activity, care, windows operating system, keyboard, and ping, then you simply cannot play in 1v1 tournaments, even as you continue to play in mwc's. Of course, this is all as if everyone else has everything perfect too. You are just proving my point for me. Scared.

If you actively dodged Chohan, which you certainly did at the very least in 2006 when you were very active for mwc at the same time (and you would even go on to later claim yourself as the MVP of mwc06 - no speak of preset problems here), then you don't get to conveniently ignore that little tidbit of context while claiming you beat him in some unknown matches nobody else knows about from much earlier.

I have played on Euro hosts, and as long as there are good connection speeds between them, it is not noticeable. Certainly no 300ms pings. Also, we can see everyone's pings now anyway. I'm sure we can easily find the pings of other Euro/Finnish players on my host to test that little theory of yours out.

Speaking of ping advantages, when did you first get a non-dialup internet connection? That's a subject you seem to like to avoid. All this talk of Windows XP, and mechanical keyboards going back to 2004, so you must remember when you actually got a good internet connection too. That would make a far bigger difference in overall unit control speed than just preset selection speed.

And by the way, I fully expect that Chohan and BTT had great broadband internet back then, which I recall BTT did have a prominent host at the time. So this no doubt gave them big advantages over a lot of people during their reign. But you didn't see me and a lot of others actively dodging them in 1v1 tournaments from 2005-2008 just because they held an internet speed advantage over us, which would have been a way bigger issue than your silly keyboard preset problems.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby tirri » 31 Jul 2018, 07:31

Giant Killer General wrote:Speaking of ping advantages, when did you first get a non-dialup internet connection? That's a subject you seem to like to avoid.


I'm not avoiding any of the many questions / false claims you raised more than the other. I would just have my word backing things up and you've already established it isn't good enough so you can happily keep throwing any number of claims that I have no way of countering.

Arguing against everyone like you do against kirk probably isn't the best option if you want some discussion to keep on going. It's not like I've been caught flat out lying about myth related stuff too many times in the past 20 years

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 31 Jul 2018, 07:34

Yea, that's what I thought. Big secret with you, has been for years. But given your non-answer, I think we can all see right through that and know the answer to the question anyway. I guess the advantages only matter when other people have them, but not when you have them, right?

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 31 Jul 2018, 07:51

BIG KROK V8 SS wrote:I had never heard a thing about adrenaline until 2007. I came back and this guy has an ego and talks shit all the time. I literally thought he was some dummy account or an overzealous newb because I'd never seen him a second before that year. Shaister vouches he'd been around since the TFL days, and I believe Shai because he's always been a straight shooter with me.

Don't forget I put NC on the map with their first ever team tournament victory.


Ah that totally explains why we formed a 2-man (+6 account) clan (RoT) together in 2007... we must not have known each other. "Came back" LOL... the only things you came back from at that time was mediocrity and anonymity. You were just another Raid player until you adopted this brash personality and actually started getting good at reg myth. And I'm not arguing that I had a "name" at that point, either.. I was just an old-school "very good" TFLer and clung to it til the bitter end... I played m2 very occasionally (a lot of ww2, honestly lol) until first incarnation of Mariusnet died and got back into Myth 2 in 2002ish... mostly because my piece of shit computer at the time wouldn't run it properly before then. Moral of the story is... I was likely very good at Myth long before you even started playing.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby tirri » 31 Jul 2018, 08:04

Giant Killer General wrote:Big secret with you, has been for years.


Ummm what the...what? My big secret for years has been not telling people about my internet connection of early 2000s? You literally throw stuff like this out in every paragraph to emphasize your points. Can you please give evidence on when I have dodged people questioning me about my internet connection history?

Before 2004 I played at my parents who had dial-up isdn for the longest time. I do not remember if or when they upgraded before I moved to study at the university in 2004 and got a high speed connection. My parents happened to live in a small town of 20 000 in Eastern-Finland and I can say we were hardly at the forefront of internet speed development.

Why would you believe any of this though? Should I ask my mom if she saved some old internet contracts and scan them here?

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby Giant Killer General » 31 Jul 2018, 08:33

Yea well nobody asked for your operating system and keyboard history either, but you wanted to talk about it anyway.

So yea, exactly proves my point. You had dial-up isdn which has twice the bandwidth of standard dial-up, and never really existed in the U.S. (and possibly more than double the speed of typical sub-par America Online (AOL) connections in America at the time). And you had broadband by no later than 2004. That is absurdly early by American standards. For comparison, by the time you had broadband internet, I was still rocking the same AOL dial-up connection that was common for most Americans for years with typically 14.4k to 28.8k connection speeds.

So speaking of advantages, that is a pretty big advantage in your favor during that time. Probably helps to explain some of why your early dominance was never quite replicated in the same way in the decade-and-a-half afterward.

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Re: GKG vs Kirk Retirement Match 2010

Postby adrenaline » 31 Jul 2018, 08:45

Giant Killer General wrote:And you had broadband by no later than 2004. That is absurdly early by American standards.


This simply can't be true. I had DSL by 2002 and I lived in an ass-backwards town in northwestern Ontario... middle of nowhere, backwoods Canada and literally 2 yrs behind the rest of the world. My connection was nothing special compared to most people at that time. I'm sure AOL sucked, though... have heard stories, but personally never experienced it. Was 14.4k dialup '97-'01 though haha.. couldn't even imagine dealing with that connection now. -- "HANG UP THE FUCKING PHONE, MOM!"


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